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India Shut Down Kashmir’s Internet Access

nytimes.com

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Re: India Shut Down Kashmir’s Internet Access

#241

Post by sbmthakur »

saagarjha wrote: post #3

Shutting down the internet in an effort to "keep the peace" is really dystopian: how do Indian citizens stand for it?

I don't think you are aware about Kashmir's situation prior to the abrogation of the article. Stone-pelting(sponsored by seperatists) and murder of civilians by terrorists were common. There is also significant amount of Pakistan-backed propaganda in the valley. Pakistanis have already flooded the internet with photos/videos from Syria, Palestine etc. and are claiming them to be from Kashmir. Considering this, what do you think would've happened if communication was fully open?

Is the communication blockade bad? Yes.

Is it necessary to keep the peace? Yes.

Re: India Shut Down Kashmir’s Internet Access

#242

Post by sbmthakur »

wtmt wrote: post #173
saagarjha wrote: post #3

Shutting down the internet in an effort to "keep the peace" is really dystopian: how do Indian citizens stand for it?

Indian citizens, at least the progressive thinking ones, do not stand for shutting down the Internet connectivity for any purpose, more so since the governments (central and state) have been doing it without transparency and without strong laws or enforcement to protect freedoms. Internet Freedom Foundation [1][2] has been trying to make this a thing of the past, but it's very early days. As a tangential example, pos…

I appreciate what Internet Freedom Foundation is doing. But they are not responsible for law and order in Kashmir.

Re: India Shut Down Kashmir’s Internet Access

#243

Post by sbmthakur »

kbad1000 wrote: post #189
owaislone wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I am not sure if this will work or not but what I am sure is that the previous status quo did not work. Moreover, how long would the entire state's ambition be held hostage because of an intolerant minority in four districts in the Kashmir valley? As long as a peaceful referendum is not held that lets the people of the region decide their own future?

The deal of plebiscite cancelled itself when Pakistan invaded in 1965.

This is the official position of India. Amit Shah said this in the Parliament. Now Kashmir can only be solved through Shimla Agreement which calls for solving this issue billaterally.

Re: India Shut Down Kashmir’s Internet Access

#244

Post by sbmthakur »

nashashmi wrote: post #136
thanks1banks2 wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

India is a secular state. We treat all religions with equal respect. This is in the constitution. This issue is an internal matter following due process within our parliamentary framework.

Secular in name only. The current party has been anti minority with significant frequency and protectionist of hindu beliefs. It is the reason why Kashmir never merged with the rest of India.

> Secular in name only. The current party has been anti minority with significant frequency and protectionist of hindu beliefs

And yet the current Government has increased minority affairs budget substantially over the years[1].

1. https://m.timesofindia.com/business/india-business/62-increa...

Re: India Shut Down Kashmir’s Internet Access

#245

Post by sbmthakur »

nashashmi wrote: post #142
amalag wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hinduism is secular. Where have historically persecuted people of the world gone? To Hindu India. Indian Hindus are why Zorastrian people still exists as a religion. They had to flee Iran and Islamic domination hundreds of years ago. Hindu India has its share of casteism, which is a real problem. That I can agree with.

There is a zorastrian presence in Iran. In fact, Iran hosts the greatest number of the world minorities than any other country. Even those that have been thought of as extinct.

I somewhere read that Zorastrianism was once the primary religion of Perisan Empire? Would like to know what exactly has caused their numbers to dwindle so much.

Re: India Shut Down Kashmir’s Internet Access

#246

Post by sbmthakur »

hemansan wrote: post #157

India is preventing the fate of Yugoslavia. It would have been occupation if Kashmiris had lesser rights but that's not the case. People don't ask what rights did people of Kashmir didn't have that people of India had since 1947. India is a country of diverse religions, and ethnic groups. If a minority group demands separate nation should you give autonomy to it? If London becomes Muslim majority, and demands separat…

It's not just about the religion. Pakistan will most likely use Kashmir as a terror launchpad against other regions of India. From India's perspective, the region is strategic than anything else.

Re: India Shut Down Kashmir’s Internet Access

#247

Post by debuggerpk »

iamshs wrote: post #148
nashashmi wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They never invaded. Locals rebelled against the ruler for being independent. And asked to become part Pakistan. Army came in upon request from locals.

Nah, tribals were armed by Pakistan. Tribals from Pakhtun invaded Kashmir. Locals actually helped repel the tribal attacks. Let’s not overlook stated facts.

haha .. if you can see the irony in your comment.

So a resourceless Pakistan miraculously recovered from the bloody partition in mere three months to not only plan an insurgency, but also had the resources to execute it. Go Pakistan then? right?

Re: India Shut Down Kashmir’s Internet Access

#248

Post by debuggerpk »

iamshs wrote: post #148
nashashmi wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They never invaded. Locals rebelled against the ruler for being independent. And asked to become part Pakistan. Army came in upon request from locals.

Nah, tribals were armed by Pakistan. Tribals from Pakhtun invaded Kashmir. Locals actually helped repel the tribal attacks. Let’s not overlook stated facts.

Like you said, let's not overlook the facts. The fact is, India and Pakistan had visa on arrival up until 1974. The fact is, people from both sides of the border could still get naturalised citizens across the border up until early 70s. The fact is, both India and Pakistan did exactly the same things. Just look at the accession of Junagadh and Hyderabad estate into India. India got away with it because both the states were land locked and Pakistan couldn't help. If accession of Kashmir's raja is right, so was the declarations by nawab of junagadh and hyderabad. The fact is, the 1947 war ended with UN intervention which demanded plebiscite for kashmir. India had agreed, but so far failed to conduct that. Not only that, India doesn't even allow UN observers, while Pakistan do. I can throw in a lot of facts in here.

Re: India Shut Down Kashmir’s Internet Access

#249

Post by xbmcuser »

sbmthakur wrote: post #241
saagarjha wrote: post #3

Shutting down the internet in an effort to "keep the peace" is really dystopian: how do Indian citizens stand for it?

I don't think you are aware about Kashmir's situation prior to the abrogation of the article. Stone-pelting(sponsored by seperatists) and murder of civilians by terrorists were common. There is also significant amount of Pakistan-backed propaganda in the valley. Pakistanis have already flooded the internet with photos/videos from Syria, Palestine etc. and are claiming them to be from Kashmir. Considering this, what d…

Hmm if the Pakistani people and media are lying keeping the internet open and showing their lies should be the reaction. Keeping it closed and hiding what is happening inside Kashmir will make the situation worse.

Re: India Shut Down Kashmir’s Internet Access

#250

Post by sbmthakur »

xbmcuser wrote: post #249
sbmthakur wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think you are aware about Kashmir's situation prior to the abrogation of the article. Stone-pelting(sponsored by seperatists) and murder of civilians by terrorists were common. There is also significant amount of Pakistan-backed propaganda in the valley. Pakistanis have already flooded the internet with photos/videos from Syria, Palestine etc. and are claiming them to be from Kashmir. Considering this, what d…

Hmm if the Pakistani people and media are lying keeping the internet open and showing their lies should be the reaction. Keeping it closed and hiding what is happening inside Kashmir will make the situation worse.

You can't debunk each and every Twitter and Facebook post. And while one does that, some of it will already have its effect on the masses.
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