Do we need to worry about artificial stupidity? • Hacker News Board

Re: Do we need to worry about artificial stupidity?

#31

Post by PakG1 » Wed, Aug 14, 2019, 11:23 AM UTC

nradov wrote: post #27

narrator wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which calls into question the whole idea that democracy even works and that people can actually think for themselves and aren't just controlled by whatever propaganda happens to show up in front of their faces. I don't even argue politics with people any more because it's almost 100% what news sources they trust and find credible. It's all just rumor and innuendo these days. Those news sources trust and find credible…

Democracy was never intended to work. It's just better than the alternatives over the long run.

Depending on what happens in the next 6 years in all major democratic powers, I may or may not still agree with that sentiment.

edit: 6 years isn't long enough to figure it out. Let's say a decade.

Re: Do we need to worry about artificial stupidity?

#32

Post by AndunD » Wed, Aug 14, 2019, 11:25 AM UTC

skilled wrote: post #18

al_form2000 wrote: post #14

'There is no doubt that AI may one day become much more intelligent than humans' Really?

"no doubt" and "may" are two words that contradict one another. Clearly whoever wrote that has no idea what they are talking about.

Definitely on the other hand.

The writer, if anyone, could consider the future of stronger AI without the artificial stupidity. Then he, too, would stumble upon the great joys of folding multiple sources of falsity into a single tablet, a simulacrum.

I vouch for that uncertainty. We must agree to disagree to all have a look in the mirror, when we can't discern between AI and that. For any number (> 0, to be perfectly rational) of times, because it is a duty and a necessity.

However, I would not be so sure of myself today if it weren't for my wife; she keeps the existential dread out. I don't actually have a wife, but I do have a brain. One makes ends meet.

It's that simple.

---

The age of artisanal stupidity, beginning the day with a goblet of poison :')

Re: Do we need to worry about artificial stupidity?

#33

Post by pvaldes » Wed, Aug 14, 2019, 11:26 AM UTC

nradov wrote: post #27

narrator wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which calls into question the whole idea that democracy even works and that people can actually think for themselves and aren't just controlled by whatever propaganda happens to show up in front of their faces. I don't even argue politics with people any more because it's almost 100% what news sources they trust and find credible. It's all just rumor and innuendo these days. Those news sources trust and find credible…

Democracy was never intended to work. It's just better than the alternatives over the long run.

Don't blame democracy for the sins of pseudodemocracy.

Re: Do we need to worry about artificial stupidity?

#34

Post by zuuow » Wed, Aug 14, 2019, 11:26 AM UTC

mrhappyunhappy wrote: post #16

pjc50 wrote: post #11

There's a lot to be said for this line of argument. The stupidity of the Youtube recommendation engine has wrecked Brazilian politics, for example: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/11/world/americas/youtube-br... (The deliberate construction of an AI that pays people to produce lies to damage other people's health and welfare sounds like a farfetched science fiction plot. Accidentally building one, and then trying to…

YouTube recommendations feel like a direct impediment to democracy. When your recommendations consist of the same crap all the time, it may seem as though that stuff carries more weight than it really does. I wonder to what degree YouTube is responsible for the current political climate. The same with Twitter really. When you only follow and see posts from people you choose, how are you supposed to give important iss…

Mass media feels like a direct impediment to democracy. When what they publish consist of the same crap all the time, it may seem as though that stuff carries more weight than it really does.

I wonder to what degree the mass media are responsible for the current political climate.

Re: Do we need to worry about artificial stupidity?

#35

Post by pvaldes » Wed, Aug 14, 2019, 11:33 AM UTC

julienreszka wrote: post #8

Inu wrote: post #7

One shouldn't underestimate the intelligence of stupidity. It can have its own utility, strength and creativity within certain parameters.

What do you mean? I don't understand

Stupid people tend to die and gave example, or make bombastic plans that later explode in their face, so we, the rest of stupid people can learn something about the experience. Don't gobble this berries nor those shiny mushroms, don't pet this nice crocodile, don't jump over this small canyon with a too short pole... the list is endless.

Re: Do we need to worry about artificial stupidity?

#36

Post by BaronSamedi » Wed, Aug 14, 2019, 11:37 AM UTC

DanielBMarkham wrote: post #26

narrator wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which calls into question the whole idea that democracy even works and that people can actually think for themselves and aren't just controlled by whatever propaganda happens to show up in front of their faces. I don't even argue politics with people any more because it's almost 100% what news sources they trust and find credible. It's all just rumor and innuendo these days. Those news sources trust and find credible…

Democracy (in the general sense) works just fine. It relies on groups of people of a certain geographic area physically getting out and interacting. Democracy isn't some guy living in his closet plugged into the web and making life choices based on AI-selected video streams. That's some kind of transhumanist nightmare. AI is an extinction-level threat to humanity, but when you say that, people think you're talking ab…

Very interesting point about Democracy. It suggests that Democracy has a natural scale, for example a city or town of a certain size. The city-states of classical antiquity, the middle ages, and the renaissance seem to support this. Of course not all the city-states were democracies, still, I think your point about physicality and democracy is grossly under-appreciated today.

Re: Do we need to worry about artificial stupidity?

#37

Post by fuzz4lyfe » Wed, Aug 14, 2019, 11:47 AM UTC

nradov wrote: post #27

narrator wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which calls into question the whole idea that democracy even works and that people can actually think for themselves and aren't just controlled by whatever propaganda happens to show up in front of their faces. I don't even argue politics with people any more because it's almost 100% what news sources they trust and find credible. It's all just rumor and innuendo these days. Those news sources trust and find credible…

Democracy was never intended to work. It's just better than the alternatives over the long run.

"Republics decline into democracies and democracies degenerate into despotisms"

-Aristotle

Re: Do we need to worry about artificial stupidity?

#38

Post by magwa101 » Wed, Aug 14, 2019, 11:49 AM UTC

Yes we do, it's called humans. This continual bashing of AI is so funny. We never measure the baseline of human activity which is chock full of stupidity, illogic and unreasonableness. Of course, AI is human directed, but it will likely be many times more predictable.

Re: Do we need to worry about artificial stupidity?

#39

Post by FakeComments » Wed, Aug 14, 2019, 11:51 AM UTC

nradov wrote: post #27

narrator wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which calls into question the whole idea that democracy even works and that people can actually think for themselves and aren't just controlled by whatever propaganda happens to show up in front of their faces. I don't even argue politics with people any more because it's almost 100% what news sources they trust and find credible. It's all just rumor and innuendo these days. Those news sources trust and find credible…

Democracy was never intended to work. It's just better than the alternatives over the long run.

Rome peaked under emperors, and the empire lasted longer than the republic.

Empiric data may not support your conclusion, though there’s not a ton of examples to draw conclusions from.

Re: Do we need to worry about artificial stupidity?

#40

Post by amrrs » Wed, Aug 14, 2019, 11:55 AM UTC

pjc50 wrote: post #11

There's a lot to be said for this line of argument. The stupidity of the Youtube recommendation engine has wrecked Brazilian politics, for example: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/11/world/americas/youtube-br... (The deliberate construction of an AI that pays people to produce lies to damage other people's health and welfare sounds like a farfetched science fiction plot. Accidentally building one, and then trying to…

I'm not sure if Youtube-driven Politics impact is really as concerned as someone being blamed as a Criminal just because of their color or someone's insurance not getting paid because of some useless reason which the model has identified as an important variable.

I think as a bunch of humans who understand this we have to really start working on saying "No to the grey"[1] area of the predictions.

[1] - https://nulldata.substack.com/p/can-artificial-intelligence-...