Earlier quoted context omitted.
You can't put the kids on the ebike to daycare? Seems like that would be faster and easier than dealing with a car. Just wait until you start in on the total mess that is school drop-off when every parent decides they have to drive their kid to school. Much faster to breeze past the stopped traffic on a bicycle, unstrap the kids and send them on their way, and bike to the train.
Not every one has only two kids. It's going to get awfully tough for those with four or five without a minivan.
Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?
361–370 of 545 posts
Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?
#362Earlier quoted context omitted.
My Model 3 charges at ~240v/48a, which is around 11kW. At peak times in our house, say, heat on, lights on, TV on, cooking, doing laundry, we pull perhaps 3kW. Our house is pretty efficient; gas appliances, LED lights, no air conditioning, etc. The car charges after 9pm, but that's just because our rate drops then. If midnight was even cheaper, it would charge then. We don't charge every day, but if we did, it would…
I imagine a world where the electricity grid is intelligent enough to have a "conversation" with appliances to efficiently spread load across the day, more accurately plan capacity, and do it at a lower cost to consumers and the environment.
All houses/apartments in Norway got new smart power meters the last couple of years. They standardized on a data interface (a bus you can connect to using a RJ45 plug), so you can access your own data if you don't want to go via your power companies API.
There are EV chargers[2] and other appliances (Heat pumps/ACs) that can react to this price indicator, charging your car when power is cheapest.
It will also load balance based on how much the rest of your house is using, they're moving towards an "wattage" fee here, to avoid massive loads at peak hours. If you get near the limit, the car charger can slow down.
Here's some images of what their app gives me[3].
It's easy to pull their data into home automation systems, here's mine[4].
You can do pretty smart stuff like: Charge my car when it's cheap, but it must be ready by 07:00.
[1]: https://developer.tibber.com/docs/guides/calling-api
[2]: https://norge.tibber.com/products/easee/
Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?
#363This stopped me from buying a Tesla with my most recent car purchase. I live in a 100 year old apartment in Boston that has 0 parking spots for over 100 units. My wife and I share a car, mostly for weekend adventuring, so we rent a spot in a dude's backyard down the block from us. It works well for us, much more convenient than the rat race of street parking. But it was hard to imagine that life with a Tesla. I could…
I've been trickle charging for the last 3+ years I've owned a Tesla. I live in a condo and the HOA was ok with me pulling an extension from an existing 110V line and charging from it for a nominal fee (we agreed to $50/mo). I got an electrician to pull an extension (cost ~$200). I have a non-driving commute and use the car mostly on the weekends, so it's worked out great vs the cost of installing a level-2 charger ($…
Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?
#364This stopped me from buying a Tesla with my most recent car purchase. I live in a 100 year old apartment in Boston that has 0 parking spots for over 100 units. My wife and I share a car, mostly for weekend adventuring, so we rent a spot in a dude's backyard down the block from us. It works well for us, much more convenient than the rat race of street parking. But it was hard to imagine that life with a Tesla. I could…
Per your circumstances (living in Boston, already possess a car, drive occasionally), a new Tesla purchase might be non-ideal even besides the charging issue, from a climate standpoint. There is a breakeven point where your cumulative carbon savings from using Boston electricity (i.e. mostly natural gas) versus gasoline intersect the one-time carbon emissions from manufacturing a new automobile. For folks who already…
Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?
#365Earlier quoted context omitted.
The article is about how people can't charge while they are at sleep. There's going to be a huge portion of people who can't charge at work. I guess you have to charge at groceries, which you'll need to go to every day. Though the grocery store will need to be dramatically refitted to support that, and will need to justify having a power grid the size of their parking lot increasing their power bill just because it's…
Why would you need to do it every day? EV ranges are rising above 200 miles, that's an order of magnitude higher than most peoples commutes, so for most people once a week would be enough. Shops would do it because money and footfall.
Because people are talking about how it only takes a short time to recharge enough to offset one day's commute. That only works, though, if you charge every day. If you only charge weekly then you're stuck waiting to recover 200 miles' worth of charge at a time in preparation for the next week. If you're using a fast-charger near somewhere you need to be anyway for an hour or two every week, great. Otherwise that adds up to a lot of wasted time—and human time is the least renewable resource we have.
Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?
#366Earlier quoted context omitted.
You have to add "redesigned cities" to that list. Electric vehicles are almost as much a patch for ICE cities as they are a replacement for internal combustion.
Some cities in mainland Europe are like this already. They make cars unnecessary. Even bikes, as you can walk everywhere. I'm talking about midsized cities (100-300k inhabitants) that are really compact thanks to 4-8 levels in every apartment block and ubiquitous use of lifts. Lifts are the disruptive technology. They make energetically efficient cities possible and cheap. I also find these cities much more nice to l…
Are lifts really as efficient as escalators? An escalator is constantly moving (unless it's malfunctioning), so there is no wait to continue moving. An elevator on the other hand is not. Maybe it depends on the number of floors? I can see an elevator being faster going from ground to floor 40 rather than zig zagging floors from ground to 40. Does anybody use "express" escalators that skip floors allowing for faster transit to higher floors?
Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?
#367First, why I'm a special case. I live in Japan. Compared to Canada (and I assume most of the US), the charger situation here is amazing. We've done a fair few road trips now and it seems like no matter where we go, there is a fast charger within 2-5 km. At least 25% of the rest stops on the highway have them. A large percentage of "michi no eki" (Road station -- essentially farmers markets) have them -- to the point where the other day we were on a road trip and were very surprised to see a michi no eki that didn't didn't have one. Family Mart convenience store often has one (something like 1 in 10, I would guess). Aeon (big shopping mall) has one or two (and often 15-20 200V chargers) and every Nissan and Mitsubishi dealership has one.
This is really the future, I think. It costs millions to make a gas station. It costs thousands to put in a fast charger. You can put one anywhere because we already have the electrical infrastructure in place. I know several restaurants that have put them in.
At the moment, there is way more infrastructure than demand, so I very rarely have to wait. If, for some reason I do, then I drive 2km the road and charge there. It's hard to know if this will get better or worse as things scale up, but for the moment it's pretty good.
I'm also in a good situation in that I work from home. When I want to charge the car (a couple of times a week), I drive to the Family Mart, plug in, pick up a few groceries and then work for 30 minutes to an hour. They have a table (with power, even) for people to work at. It's air conditioned. It's so convenient, it's crazy.
However, it's the same thing when we travel. Our car only has a 30 kWh range, so we have to stop relatively frequently. But since there are chargers all over the place, we just stop and walk around. We often end up buying small things, or having a snack. We've seen so many amazing things since we got the EV because we're forced to stop and hang out in the small towns.
I think people are going to cash in on this. You are going to see small towns with parking lots with validated charging. People are going to drive by, stop, pick up a few things and carry on. Already the rest stops in Japan are absolutely geared for this: the have souvenir stores, restaurants and even things like clothing stores.
I think this is going to be a thing because compared to a gas station, it's cheap and it's also really nice. I thought I would dread charging the car. It's actually one of the best parts of my week. I get out and meet people. I slow down a bit. I get some shopping done.
Canada is kind of a difficult problem because it has 25x the land area and 1/4 the population of Japan. It's going to be tough. Also, they don't have any particular reason for someone to invest money in the infrastructure. Nissan and Mitsubishi are doubtlessly scared stiff of the time when Toyota and Honda enter the market. They want to own that charging infrastructure -- so they are going crazy right now. But I think it's actually inevitable, so if you have a fair amount of capital and are looking for a long term investment, I think this is a good one.
Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?
#368Earlier quoted context omitted.
Sounds like a pretty tight-fisted workplace. You would think they'd want to encourage employees to sustainable transport, not try to make a profit on charging.
That's an extremely normal workplace. I've checked out tons of workplaces in my city, and for the ones that actually have chargers, the standard seems to be $2/hr for the first couple of hours and $4/hr thereafter. A workplace that's willing to give up money to help people buy EVs would be uncommonly generous.
In other states without those laws, many of the networks charge by the KWh.
Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?
#369This stopped me from buying a Tesla with my most recent car purchase. I live in a 100 year old apartment in Boston that has 0 parking spots for over 100 units. My wife and I share a car, mostly for weekend adventuring, so we rent a spot in a dude's backyard down the block from us. It works well for us, much more convenient than the rat race of street parking. But it was hard to imagine that life with a Tesla. I could…
Per your circumstances (living in Boston, already possess a car, drive occasionally), a new Tesla purchase might be non-ideal even besides the charging issue, from a climate standpoint. There is a breakeven point where your cumulative carbon savings from using Boston electricity (i.e. mostly natural gas) versus gasoline intersect the one-time carbon emissions from manufacturing a new automobile. For folks who already…
That's a break even period of only 15,000 miles. Unless your gas car will be tossed away in under 15,000 miles you are adding more CO2 to the air- and that's assuming you actually make 29 mpg, which is not likely on a car that is only 15k miles from EOL. Even if you don't touch the car for years, if you eventually sell the car the next owners are practically guaranteed to drive that many miles. The average American drives that far in 13 months.
Of course the money you spend on a new electric car might be better spent elsewhere, but in any state with a moderately clean grid, replacing a gas car with an electric car is a clear winning choice. Even on the very dirtiest grids in the US a Model 3 produces half as much CO2 as a gas car making 30 mpg- even slightly less than a Prius. The payback time is still only ~30k-35k miles, and in all likelihood owners will put several times that on the car.
[1]: https://www.ucsusa.org/clean-vehicles/electric-vehicles/ev-e...
[2]: https://www.ucsusa.org/sites/default/files/attach/2015/11/Cl...
Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?
#370Earlier quoted context omitted.
Or build out infrastructure in those areas too. In suburbs, there's plenty of room for separate bike paths and trains. It doesn't require everyone to move into Soviet-style superblocks and towers.
Trains don’t work in suburbs not because of space limitations - there just aren’t enough paying customers per mile of track to make the economics work.