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Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

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Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#261

Post by acuozzo »

kennywinker wrote: post #150
dtwest wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That doesn't work in many low density areas (prime example is American suburbia). So your answer for those people is to make them move to a more dense area that can support such solutions. Which isn't a bad idea, but it's a much harder thing to accomplish.

Ebike/scoot to transit hub, trains to commercial areas. It’s not rocket science.

Have you ever attempted to ride one of these through snow?

Also, how would something like this work with little kids?

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#262

Post by secabeen »

JustSomeNobody wrote: post #20

This is why we need standard, swappable battery packs. You pull into a "filling station" and a robot pulls your used pack and pops in a new one. 5 minutes, in and out. Sad thing is, this isn't a new idea. People just don't seem to want it.

One of the reasons is that batteries are expensive, and can be damaged/degraded. If I have a nice battery that I've treated well, and I swap it at the swap station for a different one, I would be unhappy if I got a totally worn-out battery.

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#263

Post by claytoneast »

ryanmercer wrote: post #130
oh_hello wrote: post #114

I always thought this was a big problem for EVs, but recently came to think nightly charging might not matter so much for these drivers. If an urban apartment dweller has an EV with 200+ miles of range, can't a public fast charger be used once or twice a week instead? I lived in an apartment with a ~200 mile range ICE car and filled it less than once a week.

>can't a public fast charger be used once or twice a week instead? It takes me less than 2 minutes to fill up my tank and pay, now you want me to sit 1-4 hours at a fast charger a week twiddling my thumbs? Never mind the fact a Tesla Model 3 starts at my annual salary.

Why is a fast charger 1-4 hours a week? You can do an 80% charge in a Tesla Model 3 in 24 minutes with the new generation of Superchargers, https://electrek.co/2019/07/02/tesla-supercharger-v3-range-m.... That will only improve in the coming years. 1-4 hours is not a valid charge time even now.

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#264

Post by wffurr »

ummonk wrote: post #133
wffurr wrote: post #127

Yet another reason the real answer to the climate crisis isn't EVs - it's public transit, bicycles, e-bikes, scooters, e-scooters, walking, etc. All these other modes are much lower impact on the environment than purchasing and operating an EV, much less an ICE.

Plenty of travel (both commutes and long distance travel) which is too lengthy for bicycles / scooters, but doesn't have public transit servicing it.

So build the transit. It's cheaper than highways and doubly so when you factor in the private vehicle cost borne by users of those highways.

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#265

Post by ysavir »

ummonk wrote: post #133
wffurr wrote: post #127

Yet another reason the real answer to the climate crisis isn't EVs - it's public transit, bicycles, e-bikes, scooters, e-scooters, walking, etc. All these other modes are much lower impact on the environment than purchasing and operating an EV, much less an ICE.

Plenty of travel (both commutes and long distance travel) which is too lengthy for bicycles / scooters, but doesn't have public transit servicing it.

I think that's GP's point: Instead of investing in EVs, we should be expanding public transport to reduce the dependencies on personal vehicles in the first place.

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#266

Post by protonimitate »

dabinat wrote: post #259

Why is this a problem? Gas-powered cars don’t fill up when they’re parked. Just solve the problem the same way - let people go to a specific place to charge their car like they do to fill up with gas. I have a Tesla and live in an apartment and it’s really not a big problem. The Superchargers are pretty convenient. And once Tesla rolls out L3 chargers more widely it will be even easier.

How fast is a charge though? Gas stations can fill a tank of gas in a few minutes.

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#267

Post by wffurr »

golover721 wrote: post #204
wffurr wrote: post #127

Yet another reason the real answer to the climate crisis isn't EVs - it's public transit, bicycles, e-bikes, scooters, e-scooters, walking, etc. All these other modes are much lower impact on the environment than purchasing and operating an EV, much less an ICE.

It’s never going to be a one size fits all solution. While all the things you mention work for “some” people, an EV is the best option for “some” people.

Yeah, which is why it's such a huge problem to jam cars everywhere, even places they don't belong like city centers.

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#268

Post by wffurr »

acuozzo wrote: post #261
kennywinker wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ebike/scoot to transit hub, trains to commercial areas. It’s not rocket science.

Have you ever attempted to ride one of these through snow? Also, how would something like this work with little kids?

Biked in snow plenty of times. It's fine. Also cities can plow bike trails even easier than they plow streets.

Plenty of bike options for little kids. Seats, trailers, box bikes, etc. etc.

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#269

Post by Brakenshire »

chc wrote: post #177
kennywinker wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sitting twidding your thumbs. If they are near somewhere you want to be recreationally, you’re set. The gym, the grocery store, the movies, a hiking trail, spending 1-4 hours at one of these once a week would likely enhance your life not take away from it.

If your solution to the difficulty of finding an EV charger is "put EV chargers literally everywhere," that would hypothetically solve the problem, but how do you propose to make that happen? That's what the question here is.

Low power points aren’t expensive.

Ultimately if it was the other way around, and gasoline cars were the new technology, people would think it was mad to put huge underground storage depots filled with explosive liquid dotted throughout residential neighbourhoods. Charging infrastructure will just become normal. If there are people willing to pay to use it there are people who are going to fit it.

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#270

Post by stetrain »

neogodless wrote: post #232
stetrain wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both of my local Tesla chargers are in the same parking lots as grocery stores. One is also near a movie theater and several restaurants. EV charging (except specifically for long distance travel) is less about "Let's sit here while the car charges" and more "Let's plan a thing we were probably going to do anyway at a place that also has EV chargers". Obviously that gets a lot easier as more chargers get installed. E…

I don't want to sound like a broken record but... how many times do you go to fill up your car with gasoline, and you think "Where can I go/what activity can I fill my time with so I can get gas?" (At worst, you think, what gas station is on the way?) It makes perfect sense that in this less than ideal scenario where chargers are sparse and inconvenient that you change up what you do for entertainment to center it ar…

Sure, charging an EV is not the same paradigm as filling a car with gas. I'm just not sure it needs to be. If every Target, Walmart, and Whole Foods had a bunch of EV chargers that could charge your car to 80-90% in 30 minutes that would handle the charging needs for a lot of car owners.

For "everyone" to have EVs we will need chargers at apartments and work places, or for fast chargers to get into the 80% charge in ~5min range.

That problem is not solved yet but is being tackled from both sides.

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