Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars? • Hacker News Board

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#81

Post by NullPrefix » Mon, Aug 12, 2019, 6:15 PM UTC

duskwuff wrote: post #73

Finnucane wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a guy with a Tesla around the corner from me, who does this (cable out the 2nd floor window), and he does park on the street. Not sure what he does if he can't get a space close enough. (A neighborhood of row houses with little off-street parking) I think the car makers have to accelerate integrating solar charging into their cars. You probably wouldn't get 100% of your charge that way, but you could get enou…

> I think the car makers have to accelerate integrating solar charging into their cars. Nah. Solar on cars is a dead-end -- even with perfectly efficient solar panels, a clear sky, and the sun at the zenith, the most power you can possibly get is 1.3 kW/m² (cf. [1]). I don't know exactly how large of a solar panel you could put on a car, but even with a huge 5 m² panel, you'd still be looking at over 12 hours (i.e, m…

> over 12 hours (i.e, multiple days of charging) to charge a Tesla's 85 kWh battery.

The tone is somewhat pessimistic.

Full charge every two-to-three days for a range of ... what is it? 265 miles? Effectively untethered car if you only need 50 miles daily.

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#82

Post by chc » Mon, Aug 12, 2019, 6:16 PM UTC

toomuchtodo wrote: post #2

Several states have laws that require apartment building and condo managers to allow tenants/owners to install EV chargers (at their own cost). I expect this trend to continue slowly across the US. If you can't charge at home, public charging is going to continue to expand rapidly (as electricity is everywhere). It'll just take some time, and effort on the part of local citizens and policy makers. If you own an EV, g…

Those laws seem like such a raw deal, though, since it's not like you can take the charger with you. You're allowed to upgrade your landlord's property at your own expense, providing you also take out an insurance policy at your own expense. And even if you're fine with that, it doesn't really help "garage orphans," since you can only do it if you have a garage or assigned parking space with access to electricity.

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#83

Post by Reason077 » Mon, Aug 12, 2019, 6:17 PM UTC

SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #69

AshleyGrant wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Put the fast chargers at shopping centers.. Unless the car is run down to nearly a dead battery, it won't need but about 20 minutes on the charger. That's about how long a short trip to the grocery store takes.

Is it feasible to put in hundreds of high voltage chargers?

Perhaps not today, because there aren't enough cars to use them - demand needs to catch up. But yes, it's feasible to fill entire parking lots with outlets at every parking spot. There are already examples of this in Norway.

The outlets can be built to share and distribute available power, so the grid connection required is not as huge as you might think. In practice this isn't an issue, as it's unlikely that every outlet will be drawing the maximum current at the same time.

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#84

Post by JustSomeNobody » Mon, Aug 12, 2019, 6:21 PM UTC

freehunter wrote: post #51

goatinaboat wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People just don't seem to want it. People right now feel that the advantages of batteries integrated throughout the chassis are greater.

Yeah standard swappable batteries are nice but as we can see in the cell phone and laptop world, they're very restrictive on design choices. And since EVs are very sensitive to weight and aerodynamics, coupled with the fact that EV makers are trying to put as many batteries into the car as they can, there's just no way to make a one-size-fits-all battery that works for every car. You'd either need to trade off batter…

> You'd either need to trade off battery density (which means EV range concerns are amplified)

So, instead of being able to go 300 miles before charging for an hour, I could go 225 but change it out in 5 minutes. I'll take the latter thank you.

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#85

Post by xkcd-sucks » Mon, Aug 12, 2019, 6:27 PM UTC

dmitrygr wrote: post #53

arkitaip wrote: post #37

Once cars get smart enough to actually drive on their own, your car can sneak off to the nearest charging station while you are at work or sleeping at home.

So what do we do for the 50 years between now and then?

Run a gas-powered generator in the back seat?

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#86

Post by murph-almighty » Mon, Aug 12, 2019, 6:27 PM UTC

Whatarethese wrote: post #27

microtherion wrote: post #18

Our neighborhood Teshole is solving the problem by parking across the sidewalk. They do have a garage, but that's for storing their other car.

Teshole? You sound reasonable

I thought it was clever! And OP's neighbor IS parking on the sidewalk...

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#87

Post by gist » Mon, Aug 12, 2019, 6:30 PM UTC

dmitrygr wrote: post #52

rootusrootus wrote: post #6

Why does everyone need a place to charge at home? Sure, it is one of the big advantages of an EV, but not everyone can take advantage of it. If the car has a 300-400 mile range, then charge it like you fuel up a gas-powered car. Takes a little bit longer, but that will improve over time.

A little longer? What am I going to do at a gas station for an hour? I am already bored when I am there for 3 minutes with an ICE car...

Exactly. I simply don't get this. All of that effort when it's (for lack of a better way to put it) 'not ready for prime time'. Other comments include running an electric extension cord out the window and other hacks. A cord out the window be serious.

Imagine for a second of what compensating good could be done for the world if people put the same time, thought or effort into something else with more immediate (and urgent payback).

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#88

Post by gist » Mon, Aug 12, 2019, 6:32 PM UTC

stcredzero wrote: post #4

I used to run an extension cord out of my 2nd floor window, but I wasn't parking on the street. My space was off the driveway, behind a fence and a gate, but only about 12 feet from the curb. More recently, I had been parking an electric car in my apartment's lot, and running an extension cord from the exercise room, out to the car. Then the apartment decided to close off those outlets. In both cases, the car's batte…

> I used to run an extension cord out of my 2nd floor window

> More recently, I had been parking an electric car in my apartment's lot, and running an extension cord from the exercise room, out to the car. Then the apartment decided to close off those outlets.

Won't even get to what I am sure others have raised about safety issues. My question is why do you go to this effort? What in you makes you want to go to this extent in order to use an electric car?

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#89

Post by Reason077 » Mon, Aug 12, 2019, 6:33 PM UTC

calyth2018 wrote: post #60

rootusrootus wrote: post #6

Why does everyone need a place to charge at home? Sure, it is one of the big advantages of an EV, but not everyone can take advantage of it. If the car has a 300-400 mile range, then charge it like you fuel up a gas-powered car. Takes a little bit longer, but that will improve over time.

I don't have a garage, and the work charger charges by the hour. So if one has an EV, and it doesn't charge quickly, you'll be dinged through the nose. Had the charger been charging for the kwh + a margin, then sure. But as is, EVs are off the table for me.

Sounds like a pretty tight-fisted workplace. You would think they'd want to encourage employees to sustainable transport, not try to make a profit on charging.

Re: Where will ‘garage orphans’ charge electric cars?

#90

Post by freehunter » Mon, Aug 12, 2019, 6:33 PM UTC

JustSomeNobody wrote: post #84

freehunter wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah standard swappable batteries are nice but as we can see in the cell phone and laptop world, they're very restrictive on design choices. And since EVs are very sensitive to weight and aerodynamics, coupled with the fact that EV makers are trying to put as many batteries into the car as they can, there's just no way to make a one-size-fits-all battery that works for every car. You'd either need to trade off batter…

> You'd either need to trade off battery density (which means EV range concerns are amplified) So, instead of being able to go 300 miles before charging for an hour, I could go 225 but change it out in 5 minutes. I'll take the latter thank you.

Yes, that's why I mentioned the spec sheet. It doesn't matter all the additional benefits you might get if customers are looking at just one number: range.