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NULL license plate not such a bright idea

knrs.iheart.com

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Re: NULL license plate not such a bright idea

#111

Post by tdiggity »

reaperducer wrote: post #84
ldoughty wrote: post #36

I have a family member who's license plate started with "&". The DMV accepts it, plates were ordered online fine, but police systems can't handle it apparently, to my family members ultimate discomfort. I commonly joke it probably gets the individual out of automated tickers for speeding and red lights, but when an officer pulls them over we sometimes need to explain that the "&" is dropped in the system (or so we've…

I sometimes see California tags with a heart character in them. Does anyone know if those considered part of the number, or are they just ignored as decoration?

They're a special vanity style plate in CA. They probably just are ignored/not entered when searching. https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/detail/online/elp/elp

Re: NULL license plate not such a bright idea

#112

Post by knd775 »

jerf wrote: post #108
knd775 wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't their license plate be in quotes, though? 'NULL' != NULL

As my other comment points out, this is probably systems talking to systems talking to systems talking to systems to the nth degree. So even if the first system did in fact distinguish the NULL case from the string case, it only takes one system in the chain to be incapable of representing the difference to permanently and unrecoverably wreck it for all downstream systems. What are the odds at least one system silent…

That makes perfect sense, and seems like those most likely explanation. Thanks.

Re: NULL license plate not such a bright idea

#113

Post by jerf »

slips wrote: post #109
jerf wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt that. Normal people do not tend to use the word NULL at all. What this usually is is the result of systems that talk to systems that talk to systems that talk to systems, all in different legacy formats never written to be interchange formats. One system has true SQL NULLs, the next system down the chain only accepts strings for that field, NULL gets written as the most sensible string, and then from that poi…

Did you read the article? It literally says people at a private citation outfit put NULL in the license plate field when there is no number available.

And I still expect my story is more accurate, with theirs being a reasonable expectation of what you'd get when some techie tells their manager what happened, who tells their manager, who tells the reporter.

To be clear, I'm not denying that what you say is literally true, just that by the time I'm done filtering that particular fact through my personal belief network and personal experiences, I still end up saying that my story is more likely. It's true enough that they put a "NULL" in, it's just that the way the private firm does that is most likely that the field agents leave it blank, some software somewhere puts a NULL in some database, and the report that comes out for the enforcing authority has NULL in it. For a reporter, it's not a false statement, it's just not all the technical details.

With this story, the responsibility ends up distributed in a very plausible manner I've seen many times over; HN readers could fill in a dozens of similar stories no problem. It's a problem characteristic of these sorts of systems and the way they tend to communicate with each other.

Re: NULL license plate not such a bright idea

#114

Post by java-man »

reaperducer wrote: post #84
ldoughty wrote: post #36

I have a family member who's license plate started with "&". The DMV accepts it, plates were ordered online fine, but police systems can't handle it apparently, to my family members ultimate discomfort. I commonly joke it probably gets the individual out of automated tickers for speeding and red lights, but when an officer pulls them over we sometimes need to explain that the "&" is dropped in the system (or so we've…

I sometimes see California tags with a heart character in them. Does anyone know if those considered part of the number, or are they just ignored as decoration?

I recall the heart and plus symbols are being ignored in the system.

Re: NULL license plate not such a bright idea

#115

Post by CydeWeys »

indianSummer wrote: post #70

I own a rare collector car with a three-digit VIN. This has caused endless hassles at the DMV as well as the insurance office. Sometimes we find success by prepending the necessary number of zeros, before the VIN. Other instances in the same system require appending zeros after the VIN. The true VIN has a hyphen but that never makes it into the DMV's system. One time I got stuck in a particularly nasty loop where the…

What car is it?

Re: NULL license plate not such a bright idea

#116

Post by joering2 »

heavenlyblue wrote: post #41
joering2 wrote: post #25

There are ways to properly sanitize inputs these days so NULL becomes "NULL" (string), BUT also tons of systems moved into JSON format assuming its safe. It is not. JSON is not binary safe and there are tons of unicode chars that will break JSON. I was once overseeing system that people would bring down all the time by registering usernames that the app could not properly sanitize and they in return were breaking JSO…

No, it’s not the JSON format that is broken - it’s the parser you use for JSON that is broken.

Well not me. More like large vast of websites used to or still have. The assumption was all I need is JSON and it will properly format data during exchange.

Re: NULL license plate not such a bright idea

#117

Post by OrgNet »

jerf wrote: post #103
dhosek wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nah, because it's not unsanitized SQL at fault, but people writing a literal NULL in the license plate field when there isn't one.

I doubt that. Normal people do not tend to use the word NULL at all. What this usually is is the result of systems that talk to systems that talk to systems that talk to systems, all in different legacy formats never written to be interchange formats. One system has true SQL NULLs, the next system down the chain only accepts strings for that field, NULL gets written as the most sensible string, and then from that poi…

Maybe NULL is the default value if you don't enter anything

Re: NULL license plate not such a bright idea

#119

Post by harryh »

I recently saw a car with a license plate of B8B88BB8 (or something to that effect) that I am almost certain the owner chose to make it hard to read and transcribe correctly by either humans or computer vision systems.

I was honestly kind of impressed.

Re: NULL license plate not such a bright idea

#120

Post by juancb »

cortesoft wrote: post #11

I love when people double down out of principle, when the only person getting hurt is themselves. He refuses to change it because he did nothing wrong...sure, but you are also the only one being hurt by it. Is this really the hill to die on?

Sure he did nothing wrong because it backfired like one of Wile E. Coyote's schemes but the article makes it clear he was hoping to confuse automatic ticketing systems. He was trying to get out of tickets. Sure he didn't break the letter of the law but he tried to break the spirit of the law and it bit him. Some might call that karma, I think he needs a better hobby than standing in line at the DMV which is ultimately what he has taken up. I wonder how long he'll keep going.
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