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Death of the Neighborhood Bar

bostonmagazine.com

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Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#71

Post by rubyn00bie »

bscphil wrote: post #68
rubyn00bie wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This times 1000. Back in the day around 10 years ago I could go out and spend less than or right around $20 for a night out (a few hours at my local haunt)... now I am unable to do that for less than $70. My wages have not increased 3x; so now, I go out maybe a couple times a month... and I even still drink cheap well whiskey (Old Crow, ka-kaw!).

> GP: And I do believe that if beer prices were 1/3 of the usual, you'll see way more customers. I agree, but I don't think you'd see 3x the number of customers. > Back in the day around 10 years ago I could go out and spend less than or right around $20 for a night out (a few hours at my local haunt)... now I am unable to do that for less than $70. This makes me wonder where you live and what kind of bars you go to.…

Emphatically, no I go to the same cheap haunts I have for a decade. I drink the same cheap well whiskey.

Well-whiskey 10 years ago costed me $2.5-$3.5 now it costs me at least $7, closer to $8 or $9 with a tip. A meal at a pub used to cost around $6-8 now it costs between $13-$19 dollars.

Essentially, I believe, in larger cities prices are more stable for things like booze because you've already hit the acceptable limit for what people are willing to pay. In cities that are already the most expensive, the change will never be enormous, as you all are probably only seeing the increase in price due to inflation.

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#72

Post by Thriptic »

lb1lf wrote: post #60
rexgallorum2 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amen! Drinking in public should be as ordinary and mundane as it is in Germany.

From my experience, (Norwegian, but have spent a year or so in Germany over a couple of dozen visits), the Germans have found a quite good balance: Drinking in public is OK. Being drunk and a nuisance in public is not OK. I wish we could adopt the same attitude back home - here in Norway you are likely to be fined for drinking in public (though the extent to which drinking is tolerated vary considerably from place to…

> Drinking in public is OK.

> Being drunk and a nuisance in public is not OK.

In my experience, this is basically the way it already is in many places in the US. As long as you put even a modicum of effort into complying with the letter of the law in front of cops (ie using a brown paper bag, putting alcohol into a non-obvious container, etc) and you're in compliance with the spirit of the law (ie not being a loud and disruptive drunk asshole in public), the cops will generally leave you alone and you can responsibly consume freely in public venues.

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#73

Post by criddell »

rexgallorum2 wrote: post #30
crazygringo wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I honestly can't understand that at all. The "third place" has exploded and has never been more vibrant in the history of mankind, at least if you live in a city. Yoga classes, coffee shops, CrossFit, meetups, hiking groups, rock climbing, dance parties, marathons, evening painting classes where they serve wine, improv comedy shows, improv comedy classes, cooking classes, language classes, indie band shows of every t…

That is true, but those are all interest based activities, things you do at 7pm on a Tuesday night, between getting off work and passing out while watching netflix. They aren't places where one can go to simply 'be', or to mingle with strangers. In Ireland for example, people would do those things and then go to the pub afterwards. Think of the Prancing Pony in the Lord of the Rings...a place where locals and travell…

> In Ireland for example, people would do those things and then go to the pub afterwards.

I love the idea of a hot yoga session before heading to the pub for a couple of pints and some darts.

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#74

Post by csomar »

bscphil wrote: post #68
rubyn00bie wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This times 1000. Back in the day around 10 years ago I could go out and spend less than or right around $20 for a night out (a few hours at my local haunt)... now I am unable to do that for less than $70. My wages have not increased 3x; so now, I go out maybe a couple times a month... and I even still drink cheap well whiskey (Old Crow, ka-kaw!).

> GP: And I do believe that if beer prices were 1/3 of the usual, you'll see way more customers. I agree, but I don't think you'd see 3x the number of customers. > Back in the day around 10 years ago I could go out and spend less than or right around $20 for a night out (a few hours at my local haunt)... now I am unable to do that for less than $70. This makes me wonder where you live and what kind of bars you go to.…

3 beers, a side item, a tip and 2 Ubers could take the total bill to $70. Now if you live in a walking distance (probably somewhere in the middle of the action in a walkable place like NYC) that could cut down the costs. This might explain why dense cities have more nightlife. It's cheaper both from a $ and effort perspective to go out.

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#75

Post by criddell »

bluedino wrote: post #39
Scoundreller wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And don't forget about the criminalization of drinking wine or beer in a park or beach in N. America.

You can blame it on young people. Nobody wants to be on a beach with a bunch of bros being loud, passing out, fighting...

There's a decent argument to be made that the over-consumption which leads to the obnoxious behaviors is a result of the laws that make drinking a rebellious activity.

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#76

Post by freehunter »

Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #66
crazygringo wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I honestly can't understand that at all. The "third place" has exploded and has never been more vibrant in the history of mankind, at least if you live in a city. Yoga classes, coffee shops, CrossFit, meetups, hiking groups, rock climbing, dance parties, marathons, evening painting classes where they serve wine, improv comedy shows, improv comedy classes, cooking classes, language classes, indie band shows of every t…

> coffee shops Central Europe is losing the vibrant cafe culture it used to have, where people could sit together for hours and chat. Cafes today often blast loud pop music and send staff around more frequently to pester clients who seem to have finished their drinks, as owners believe this will prevent people from loitering. Instead, customers will quickly drink what they ordered and then get out, freeing the table…

Speaking here in the US, if you don't have a local coffee shop your neighborhood is probably not very vibrant, and lots of business happens in these local coffee shops. I host meetings at my local coffee shop all the time and see others doing the same thing. Even if all you have is Starbucks, there's still tons of meetings that happen at Starbucks and you're not likely to be hassled to leave.

I'm much more likely to be pushed out the door at my local brewery or bar than I am at a coffee shop. If I had to guess it's because coffee tends to be a grab-and-go whereas beer cannot be served in a to-go cup so it has to be served and consumed inside the building with few alternatives if the seats are all full.

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#77

Post by wry_discontent »

Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #66
crazygringo wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I honestly can't understand that at all. The "third place" has exploded and has never been more vibrant in the history of mankind, at least if you live in a city. Yoga classes, coffee shops, CrossFit, meetups, hiking groups, rock climbing, dance parties, marathons, evening painting classes where they serve wine, improv comedy shows, improv comedy classes, cooking classes, language classes, indie band shows of every t…

> coffee shops Central Europe is losing the vibrant cafe culture it used to have, where people could sit together for hours and chat. Cafes today often blast loud pop music and send staff around more frequently to pester clients who seem to have finished their drinks, as owners believe this will prevent people from loitering. Instead, customers will quickly drink what they ordered and then get out, freeing the table…

There's a hookah bar by my apartment that has just the vibe I crave from a coffee shop. It takes ~1 hour to smoke a whole hookah, and you can go with some friends, socialize, work quietly, and they don't blast music. I believe it's like that because it's next to a university and usually full of students. Other ones around me aren't like that.

Unfortunately, it comes with some dangers...nicotine.

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#78

Post by almost_usual »

selimthegrim wrote: post #26

This is so emphatically untrue in New Orleans I have to wonder if the writer has ever visited.

Same with most cities and towns in the Midwest. The neighborhood bar isn’t going anywhere there.

I can see Boston, SF, Austin, and other transplant cities losing neighborhood bars. The people who to go bars there aren’t locals and they probably aren’t expecting to go to the same place for decades. They probably aren’t even expecting to live in the same place more than three years.

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#79

Post by bscphil »

csomar wrote: post #74
bscphil wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> GP: And I do believe that if beer prices were 1/3 of the usual, you'll see way more customers. I agree, but I don't think you'd see 3x the number of customers. > Back in the day around 10 years ago I could go out and spend less than or right around $20 for a night out (a few hours at my local haunt)... now I am unable to do that for less than $70. This makes me wonder where you live and what kind of bars you go to.…

3 beers, a side item, a tip and 2 Ubers could take the total bill to $70. Now if you live in a walking distance (probably somewhere in the middle of the action in a walkable place like NYC) that could cut down the costs. This might explain why dense cities have more nightlife. It's cheaper both from a $ and effort perspective to go out.

I think you may have hit it. This article is about the "neighborhood" bar. In other words, it's a place where you meet with people who live nearby. A neighborhood bar is not a place that's a $10+ Uber away.

Which isn't exactly the fault of anyone who has to take one for a night out. This points to a nexus of problems with American cities, including sprawl, and the fact that few people know their neighbors.

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#80

Post by Thriptic »

Causality1 wrote: post #2

On any other planet the death of the bar industry would be hailed as a victory against alcoholism and date rape.

Is it true that some users of bars are alcoholics? Definitely. Is it true that some users of bars want to participate in date rape? Definitely. Is it likely that these users represent even a small percentage of overall bar patrons? No. We don't need to shut down an entire industry to protect a tiny subset of users.
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