Death of the Neighborhood Bar • Hacker News Board

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#41

Post by [deleted] » Sun, Aug 11, 2019, 5:31 PM UTC

rexgallorum2 wrote: post #30

crazygringo wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I honestly can't understand that at all. The "third place" has exploded and has never been more vibrant in the history of mankind, at least if you live in a city. Yoga classes, coffee shops, CrossFit, meetups, hiking groups, rock climbing, dance parties, marathons, evening painting classes where they serve wine, improv comedy shows, improv comedy classes, cooking classes, language classes, indie band shows of every t…

That is true, but those are all interest based activities, things you do at 7pm on a Tuesday night, between getting off work and passing out while watching netflix. They aren't places where one can go to simply 'be', or to mingle with strangers. In Ireland for example, people would do those things and then go to the pub afterwards. Think of the Prancing Pony in the Lord of the Rings...a place where locals and travell…

[deleted]

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#42

Post by maxerickson » Sun, Aug 11, 2019, 5:33 PM UTC

csomar wrote: post #16

Anybody think it's about price? At least the quoted guy thinks so > Why go to a bar when you can go to a yoga class, WhatsApp your friends, crack open an inexpensive bottle of wine at home, and watch something on Amazon Prime? And I do believe that if beer prices were 1/3 of the usual, you'll see way more customers. Boston and some other US cities I have visited have, inexplicably, very high prices for bars and resta…

Here it's a 15 minute walk to half a dozen bars that serve $3 and $4 drinks. There's cheaper housing that is closer to those bars, so it isn't a special location or anything, just a normal smaller town.

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#43

Post by rexpop » Sun, Aug 11, 2019, 5:36 PM UTC

crazygringo wrote: post #22

thinkingkong wrote: post #5

If we remove alcohol from the equation I think whats more pertinent is the death of the “third place”. Churches are dying. If the article is to be extrapolated then smaller local bars are dying. Where do people go other than online to socialize. Thats important to understand.

I honestly can't understand that at all. The "third place" has exploded and has never been more vibrant in the history of mankind, at least if you live in a city. Yoga classes, coffee shops, CrossFit, meetups, hiking groups, rock climbing, dance parties, marathons, evening painting classes where they serve wine, improv comedy shows, improv comedy classes, cooking classes, language classes, indie band shows of every t…

None of these are third places, though; they're more expensive commercial activities, and non-participatory performances. Not the same thing. They don't facilitate the same social or psychological functions as the relaxed, inexpensive, unstimulating and improvisational third-place.

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#44

Post by vidanay » Sun, Aug 11, 2019, 5:39 PM UTC

bluedino wrote: post #40

rubyn00bie wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This times 1000. Back in the day around 10 years ago I could go out and spend less than or right around $20 for a night out (a few hours at my local haunt)... now I am unable to do that for less than $70. My wages have not increased 3x; so now, I go out maybe a couple times a month... and I even still drink cheap well whiskey (Old Crow, ka-kaw!).

Move to a small town. There are still dollar beers and burgers to be had.

Careful...most of those cheap burgers are prison or school grade meat. Frozen pucks of gristle.

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#45

Post by lotsofpulp » Sun, Aug 11, 2019, 5:43 PM UTC

csomar wrote: post #16

Anybody think it's about price? At least the quoted guy thinks so > Why go to a bar when you can go to a yoga class, WhatsApp your friends, crack open an inexpensive bottle of wine at home, and watch something on Amazon Prime? And I do believe that if beer prices were 1/3 of the usual, you'll see way more customers. Boston and some other US cities I have visited have, inexplicably, very high prices for bars and resta…

If multiple sellers, who presumably are not colluding to raise prices, are selling at a certain price, then that just happens to be the market price. Cities have very expensive rent, high pay, high everything costs, so the price of the products reflect that.

Also, a bar (or club) is dependent on its social atmosphere, partly dictated by the type of clientele it brings in. A place that sells $5 beer is going for a different clientele than a place that sells $15 beer (i.e. richer people).

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#46

Post by futureastronaut » Sun, Aug 11, 2019, 5:43 PM UTC

rexgallorum2 wrote: post #14

Looks like the usual hatchetators are here to play. Bars and pubs are not the same. Bars just serve alcohol, but pubs are public living rooms and centres of communal life. A pub is where life's milestones are celebrated, the departed are grieved, friendships are cemented, matches are made, and revolutions are plotted. And some of us prefer the pleasures and pangs of gradual self-destruction to the quasi-religious cul…

> I for one never trust anyone who doesn't drink.

And if they can't drink for medical reasons?

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#47

Post by dredmorbius » Sun, Aug 11, 2019, 5:44 PM UTC

selimthegrim wrote: post #26

This is so emphatically untrue in New Orleans I have to wonder if the writer has ever visited.

Nawlins is about the most atypical American city you can find. It's best typified as Caribbean North.

That's not a slight, just an observation. And yes, virtually all major cities are fairly distinctive. As Ed Glaeser has pointed out, something of an anti-Anna Karenina principle: unsuccessful cities are all alike, successful cities are each successful in their own way.

Not entirely true, but a strong element of truth to it.

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#48

Post by apo » Sun, Aug 11, 2019, 5:47 PM UTC

About half the article is about a regular named Richard, who dies:

> When I heard that Richard was in a bad way, I figured he was at a low point in another cycle. I expected that I would just see him at the Plough the next time I dropped in. Instead, he died.

Nothing is said about what killed him, but I suspect there might be a clue here:

> Arguably, their [bars'] lifeblood—alcohol—has destroyed more American families than any drug ever has. Now the owner of the Plough, I struggle with this truth. My own family has been afflicted by alcoholism, and while “the gene,” as it is often called, bypassed me, I worry for my four-year-old twin boys. Recently, one of them snuck a sip of my beer, then thrust his right fist in the air in triumph and shouted in his deepest voice, “I am a man!” before running away gleefully. I laughed, but the episode also stabbed me with worry that he may be carrying a ticking time bomb.

It's hard to imagine the mental gymnastics that must be necessary by the owner to keep this business going.

Some patrons may be staying home, but it looks to me as if a plethora of alternative hangouts and ways to meet, not centered on alcohol, have popped up over the years:

- Meetup groups

- juice/hookah/vegan/whatever bars

- exercise/yoga classes and groups

- hookup apps

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#49

Post by craftyguy » Sun, Aug 11, 2019, 5:49 PM UTC

markbnj wrote: post #18

newnewpdro wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Downvoted to oblivion by the resident alcoholics...

Or perhaps it was downvoted by people who realize their own limited impressions of the world don't always reflect universal truths.

> people who realize their own limited impressions of the world don't always reflect universal truths.

You defintiely wouldn't get that impression by reading the comments on "hacker" "news", where many of them are people arguing that their anecdote is more correct.

Re: Death of the Neighborhood Bar

#50

Post by futureastronaut » Sun, Aug 11, 2019, 5:49 PM UTC

vidanay wrote: post #44

bluedino wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Move to a small town. There are still dollar beers and burgers to be had.

Careful...most of those cheap burgers are prison or school grade meat. Frozen pucks of gristle.

And you've gotten to the root of the decline of places like pubs: Inflation with mostly stagnant wages. Sure, you can have a "cheap" burger and beer, but more often than not you'll end up eating roadkill and drinking chemicals.

Most people just can't afford to hang out the bar all the time anymore.