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Who Owns Huawei?

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91–100 of 334 posts

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#91
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. I think you are used to Western Companies where the default is private ownership. All major Chinese companies began as state owned enterprises, and it is usually necessary to get investment from one to get a charter. So ostensibly private companies have a big state investment. Plus a trade union committee implies a government structure.

> All major Chinese companies began as state owned enterprises How come there are so many Chinese startup success stories then? Those weren't "major companies" when they began...

Show me one that did not get some funding from a state enterprise. It is almost impossible to clear the bureaucratic hurdles without that. My source for this is “China’s Crisis of Success” by William H. Overholt.

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#92
post #77

I've heard a similar observation phrased slightly differently to describe Russia. If you're looking at a large Russian company, it goes, you're by definition looking at a company that has come to some kind of accommodation with the state -- because if they hadn't, the state would never have permitted them to get large.

And if you fall out of favour, your company gets taken away from you. See Khodorkovsky as an example.

Also, see Alibaba

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also, owning some of Western popular culture is a decent geopolitical chip. Tencent is co-producing the Top Gun sequel, and Maverick's jacket no longer has either the Japanese or Taiwanese flags on the back: * https://www.esquire.com/entertainment/movies/a28479683/ * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_Gun:_Maverick > Maybe it’s not as great as a nuke, but China can use popular video games to raise the next generatio…

Which part of China is not a totalitarian state?

Taiwan.

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely, but remember that they aren’t prevented from making money or conducting legitimate business just because they answer to the party officials. It’s not worthwhile to spy on teenagers wholesale, but they might pull the logs of a senator’s kid and we would never be the wiser. Also, owning some of Western popular culture is a decent geopolitical chip. Maybe it’s not as great as a nuke, but China can use popula…

Yea if you want to change the world, reach out to the next generation? Remember all those other generations of people living in crazy societies with crazy ideas? People's values, behaviors and loyalties are basically imprinted on them during childhood. There is an Einstein quote where he talks about how 'most people can't even form their own opinions' and he is right.

>There is an Einstein quote where he talks about how 'most people can't even form their own opinions' and he is right.

QED

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#95
post #42
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Marxists have a term for what you're describing: "state capitalism."

[flagged]

OP is not saying China is Marxist. He's saying that some Marxian theorists call what in China "state capitalism." I.e. not socialism, but capitalism administered/mediated by the state.

This is by no means universal though. Other Marxists would call it a "degenerated worker's state" or "bureaucratic collectivism" or just "Stalinism"

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#96
post #86
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And if you fall out of favour, your company gets taken away from you. See Khodorkovsky as an example.

Wasn't it more like "if you try to subvert current power and install your own puppets, all using money you stole with the help of current power"? I think in China they shot such people. In US/EU that would land such person on a few blacklists instead and certain portions of business would be hard to do.

They might become secretary of state tho

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#97

I've heard a similar observation phrased slightly differently to describe Russia. If you're looking at a large Russian company, it goes, you're by definition looking at a company that has come to some kind of accommodation with the state -- because if they hadn't, the state would never have permitted them to get large.

Russia, according to famed Russian dissident Garry Kasparov, operates this way more as a mafia syndicate. Corruption allows the “oligarchs” to enrich themselves with the nation’s mineral resources so long as some of their power (and even money) remains at the beck and call of the don: Putin. China is different. It’s not an oil and gas oligarchy like Russia or the Gulf states. It is somewhat like the US was during the…

You're dead on in your assessment of them.

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#98

I've heard a similar observation phrased slightly differently to describe Russia. If you're looking at a large Russian company, it goes, you're by definition looking at a company that has come to some kind of accommodation with the state -- because if they hadn't, the state would never have permitted them to get large.

Convince me this is any different in America.

Seems like a lot of American companies have been working pretty hard to get around the sanctions to sell things to black listed Chinese companies. I would take that as pretty good evidence that American companies tend to be independent of the government.

Also it's just pretty clear in general who has what interests in large American corporations. You can look at the chain of command up to the board of directors back to the shareholders.

Re: Who Owns Huawei?

#99
There’s also something the Chinese state calls “fusion centres” which is one of the most interesting facets of this intelligence-industrial complex in China.

Essentially the state decides, let’s say high tech cutting edge batteries for storing renewable energy is where they want to invest in. They gather a few companies into a building that can do it or are interested. They then have state representatives who effectively ask “what do we need to know” and “who are the major players in the field.

In a month or so they come back again. They do big closed door presentation for all the companies in the building. Suddenly all the Chinese companies in the space start delivering R&D and eventually products that match some of the best stuff being done in the space. You could almost say they’ve learnt to copy it..

How do they do it? Industrial espionage, essentially, and building an industrial and intelligence infrastructure that allows for maximum impact of the state’s intelligence apparatus into the national economy. In a way it’s kind of brilliant.

I heard it described by an NSA analyst in a very interesting talk. I thought it was fascinating and speaks exactly to your point. The idea that we are competing with “free market” Chinese companies is a fiction that we’ve made up in our own minds. It’s just not how China works. And to be fair it’s been working gang busters for them.

edit since someone asked for it, here’s the talk - https://cybersecpolitics.blogspot.com/2017/04/fusion-centers...

My description was from memory so I hope I remembered it right.

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