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Uber Posts $5.2B Loss and Slowest Ever Growth Rate

nytimes.com

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Re: Uber Posts $5.2B Loss and Slowest Ever Growth Rate

#191

Post by everythingswan »

eanzenberg wrote: post #168
rjkennedy98 wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like this misses something crucial to how most of these arrangements work: the worker is unable to put value on the gig. That is the real asymmetry. The gig worker's car wears down, requires gas, oil changes, and gets beat up by the road, but from his perspective he sees $25. Do you think Uber would even try to estimate that number?! (which they almost certainly could). Its essentially capitalization on a huge…

What happened to personal responsibility? Is that out the window as well? Or do we need intervention, similar to how parents point their kids in the proper direction to go?

I think the challenge is that the tech is moving so fast that there is no line where the judicial system has said: "Hey Uber, that's over the line."

Credit Card and loan rates are two examples where some people would be so desperate that they would sign _anything_ to get an advance of cash or credit. But we have protection for them and rates cannot exceed a certain amount, depending on the type of loan.

Re: Uber Posts $5.2B Loss and Slowest Ever Growth Rate

#192

Post by Endy »

Well, that explains why my daily commute has gone up in the last few weeks. If they'd let me buy a ride pass, that'd at least make me use them. Instead, Lyft gets my business.

Just as a note: without a low-cost private car, I literally could not keep my job.

Re: Uber Posts $5.2B Loss and Slowest Ever Growth Rate

#193

Post by refurb »

standardUser wrote: post #37
rainyMammoth wrote: post #8

Uber and lyft are both on the way down. The price at which they need to operate to be profitable is not a price that most americans are ready to pay. As simple as that. For now they delay this reality by subsidizing rides in order to generate business. In some cities like San Francisco, most incentives were removed and among my friends we all stopped using Uber (unless we really have to). It simply became way too exp…

The difference between taxi fares and Uber/Lyft fares has all but vanished. People were willing to pay taxi rates all along, now they are doing so and getting what is arguably a much better service.

I agree with this.

Even if rates went up to what cabs were (still cheaper in SF in my experience), I wouldn't switch back to cabs. I'd still user Uber/Lyft for the convenience and higher quality product.

Re: Uber Posts $5.2B Loss and Slowest Ever Growth Rate

#194

Post by semi-extrinsic »

eanzenberg wrote: post #168
rjkennedy98 wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like this misses something crucial to how most of these arrangements work: the worker is unable to put value on the gig. That is the real asymmetry. The gig worker's car wears down, requires gas, oil changes, and gets beat up by the road, but from his perspective he sees $25. Do you think Uber would even try to estimate that number?! (which they almost certainly could). Its essentially capitalization on a huge…

What happened to personal responsibility? Is that out the window as well? Or do we need intervention, similar to how parents point their kids in the proper direction to go?

The point in having a society at all is the recognition that by agreeing on a set of rules, organizing ourselves to cooperate, people are better off.

The "what about personal responsibility" can be applied to most things society offers you. Law enforcement? Buy your own gun and defend yourself. Firefighters? Buy your own water hose. Exploitive employers? Grow your own backbone.

Re: Uber Posts $5.2B Loss and Slowest Ever Growth Rate

#196

Post by Ar-Curunir »

eloff wrote: post #139
toomuchtodo wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's time to stop assuming startups are the solution to poor public policy. This is a thread topic in itself, but I cannot let the assertion stand ("any job is better than no job, what are you going to do about it?").

On the contrary, it's better to do something as in a startup, than to complain about public policy. When your system is broken, try to fix it, when that fails, workaround it.

Startups, and specifically VC culture, do not have aligned incentives with fixing society; in the end, their aim is to make money, not improve society.

Re: Uber Posts $5.2B Loss and Slowest Ever Growth Rate

#197

Post by [deleted] »

rjkennedy98 wrote: post #149
jngreenlee wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"In some cases, no jobs is better than subsistence/dead-end/exploitative jobs" Sure, but neither you or I get to decide that qualification. Only the person doing the job does. We don't really know what fits their lives or what options they have. I don't like gig stuff/sharing economy (or the big 'unicorns' associated with it) either...but it is "another option" for many people that wouldn't have one, esp. lower skill…

I feel like this misses something crucial to how most of these arrangements work: the worker is unable to put value on the gig. That is the real asymmetry. The gig worker's car wears down, requires gas, oil changes, and gets beat up by the road, but from his perspective he sees $25. Do you think Uber would even try to estimate that number?! (which they almost certainly could). Its essentially capitalization on a huge…

[deleted]

Re: Uber Posts $5.2B Loss and Slowest Ever Growth Rate

#198

Post by ufo »

smileysteve wrote: post #58
Tiktaalik wrote: post #24

The recent realization by cities that these services are making traffic worse will induce more regulation which will make these services even less viable than they already are.

As rides get more expensive or as these companies run lower on cash to burn; I suspect we'll eventually get back to the traffic reduction use case; an easy way to make a buck driving a route you're otherwise already taking or just a few miles from your house.

I'm not sure that actual ride-sharing like that can out-compete public transit, from the point of the view of the customer.

Re: Uber Posts $5.2B Loss and Slowest Ever Growth Rate

#199

Post by xyzzyz »

aussiegreenie wrote: post #109

The most ridiculous thing in Sydney is all the Uber drivers drive for Uber, Bolt and Ola. The same car, the same driver but the only difference is a which button I push on my phone. So whoever gives me a discount I will use and if no one will I will catch a bus or taxi. Google Maps shows me the estimated cost for Uber and Bolt.

I wouldn't say it's really that ridiculous, not any more than different grocery chains carrying the same products. I think this is exactly what gig economy, and in general market capitalism, should be like -- pushing the price down through competition for the benefit of the consumer.

Re: Uber Posts $5.2B Loss and Slowest Ever Growth Rate

#200

Post by chillacy »

CydeWeys wrote: post #182
xyzzyz wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nothing about hiring a driver or maintaining or running a car is cheaper now than before Uber. Uber can use better scheduling algorithms to ensure higher utilization factor of their fleet. If a taxi driver is driving 50% of the time and waiting for a fare other 50%, while Uber driver is driving 90% of the time and waiting 10%, the price for Uber ride could be lower while ensuring the same income level for the drive…

And yet, in practice, the idle and unpaid transit time for rideshare drivers is still quite high.

And yet... higher than taxis?
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