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Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

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Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#441
post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I do not understand is why nobody copied yelp with an ethical business model yet.

Google Maps? I mean, it's not perfect, the reviews aren't great, but usually anything rated 4.5+ is at least solid and they don't mess around with restaurant phone numbers.

Many of those doordash.com “delivery” links on Google Maps didn’t come from the restaurants either.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#442

I've found Google Maps review quality and quantity improved over the last few years so it's rare that I'd even open Yelp in recent months. With this, I'm deleting my Yelp app.

When I was in physical therapy about a year ago they told me to leave reviews in Google rather than Yelp because research showed it was more effective. I found it hard to believe since my peers and I both used Yelp way more, but I find this recent behavior from Yelp abhorrent so it may be time to switch

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#443
post #413
post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I do not understand is why nobody copied yelp with an ethical business model yet.

An American version of tabelog would be amazing but idk if it would ever happen It's something I've wanted to do for awhile. Do Things that idk yelp does like give older ratings less weight. I also think the the ratings are mostly useless. 4 1/2 star restaurants in the same area are not comparable. The rounding to half puts restaurants that are miles apart to close together. Ratings below 3 are useless. Sushi in sf i…

I completely agree that this is a blind spot that current has no solution because it is ignored.

One can argue that a Michelin star restaurant is objectively better than the neighborhood McDonald's, but they could have identical ratings because the expectation of service is different. What is considered above and beyond at McD's is merely baseline at the other.

However it also works in reverse as well! Many sit-down Chinese restaurants in my area are rated poorly due to substandard service, but this is de rigeur at these establishments. The waitress is gruff, rushes you along, gives you the bill before you are ready, and in some cases, you have to make your own tea because they're too busy.

The food could be great but the ratings don't show it.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#444
post #411

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google itself isn't exactly ethical anymore unfortunately

Then add Judge Roy Bean Public House to OpenStreetMap In Denmark you will find almost all restaurant and food places in Openstreetmap. I have created tools that help to keep POI'd up-to-date by mapping to public health inspection reports. https://github.com/elgaard/OpenStreetmapTools/tree/master/re... https://digitalfrihed.dk/restaurants/all.html We could use some kind of open reviews. That is more tricky, which is a…

> I have created tools that help to keep POI'd up-to-date by mapping to public health inspection reports.

What a great idea, thank you for sharing. I'll take it upon myself to do some investigation into if those records are easily available here

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#445
post #433
post #413

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An American version of tabelog would be amazing but idk if it would ever happen It's something I've wanted to do for awhile. Do Things that idk yelp does like give older ratings less weight. I also think the the ratings are mostly useless. 4 1/2 star restaurants in the same area are not comparable. The rounding to half puts restaurants that are miles apart to close together. Ratings below 3 are useless. Sushi in sf i…

You mean only allow people to "thumbs up" or "thumbs down" a place, and then aggregate the results to form a sort of star rating? I mean because you've either had a good experience or a bad one, and if you've had an average experience why post a review?

I think for ratings the whole scale 1-5 should be used and a user should be able to rate with a decimal point of precision. And show ratings to the second decimal place. I think that would remove reviews like "great 5 stars" or poor service 1 star.

Average reviews should be added. I don't think every restaurant is perfectly average. Some are better, do a dish particularly well, have some thing else that might just slightly set it apart. Others might be average but unusually cheap. All of that can be part of an average review and influence a rating and help people find meals they're in the mood for.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#447
post #142

It feels as though much of tech has gone from helping people accomplish their goals efficiently to a business model of extracting rents while providing no or little value. In this example, what benefit is GrubHub providing to anyone? The person used Yelp solely to look up the phone number of a restaurant. GrubHub deserves 15% of his order for that? Why, because they made a deal to give X% of it to Yelp, and convinced…

It feels as though much of tech has gone from helping people accomplish their goals efficiently to a business model of extracting rents while providing no or little value.

Down vote me to hell for the "+1", but man that struck me as profound, and I wanted you to know (no contact info in profile). If only briefly, I had a moment of clarity that put a finger on that yucky feeling I feel about the tech industry lately.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The argument is that making it difficult for users not to use your mobile app is hostile. It isn't hostile - because as I stated, websites are often janky when used in a mobile browser, especially interactive websites, in which case the app is a net positive. This is my experience and opinion, and I don't hide behind "many people think __". Everyone is free to have their opinion, but I hope you realize that passing…

Again, the hostility is that users are forced to use the mobile app. Forcing someone to do something that is (granted for the sake of argument) a net positive that they do not believe is a net positive is user hostile. The question is not whether mobile apps are good things. (Everyone is free to have their own opinion about that.) The question is whether or not it's a good thing to force someone who does not want to…

No one is forced to do anything, its not a public utility. The company is free to implement their service in whatever way they want, and you as the consumer or user can ignore it and move on to something else. If you feel strongly about it, write them a letter. Sorry, what you're saying is not resonating at all, and frankly sounds a bit entitled to me. I don't think this conversation is productive for either of us. Bye!

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#449
post #445
post #433

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean only allow people to "thumbs up" or "thumbs down" a place, and then aggregate the results to form a sort of star rating? I mean because you've either had a good experience or a bad one, and if you've had an average experience why post a review?

I think for ratings the whole scale 1-5 should be used and a user should be able to rate with a decimal point of precision. And show ratings to the second decimal place. I think that would remove reviews like "great 5 stars" or poor service 1 star. Average reviews should be added. I don't think every restaurant is perfectly average. Some are better, do a dish particularly well, have some thing else that might just sl…

A service I loved in UK was Hardens, all restaurants reviewed for FSA (Food, Service, Ambience) by customers. It was very reliable. Much better than a single generic rating.

Agree with most people on Yelp having bad taste.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#450
post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the general Yelp employee vibe like when news like this comes out about features they've worked on? Is it a feeling of "meh, we're growing revenue" or more of a "they completely misunderstood the value we're delivering based on what our users asked for" scenario?

Some of both; people do care, but not everyone loves every feature. I feel that small business owners tend to be less tech savvy and more open to conspiratorial thinking, which leads to a lot of attention to anything Yelp does. If you read the comments even here on hn, many are not about the actual thing in question and many make accusations of unfair practises which have neve been accompanied by evidence. In this pa…

Thanks for the insight and for wading into the firestorm here.

From the screenshots in the article, it appears there is zero indication to the user that this will be going through Grubhub when they tap that button. Was that discussed? How do you feel about that in terms of it being sufficient notification?

Would you agree that in addition to the limited tech savvyness of restaurant owns, there may also be limited business savvy such that they would have been aware of a term that would allow Grubhub and Yelp to do this? In this case, the restaurant owner seemed to have no clue it was occurring. So presumably if the user and restaurant owner are clueless, and Yelp and Grubhub are taking a cut they may not have otherwise received, I'm a bit unclear as to how that could be viewed as any sort of positive.

Do restaurants receive any reporting of "Grubhub via Yelp" orders/calls?

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