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Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

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Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#131

Post by rmrfnodemodules »

Scoundreller wrote: post #29
kadabra9 wrote: post #12

Yelp is such a slimy company. First they wall off their mobile web reviews to try to force you to download their POS app, they have the whole extortion racket going trying to strongarm restaurants into paying for advertising, and now this. Friendly reminder - if you are on mobile and trying to read a Yelp review and don't want to download their app, simply hold refresh, click "request desktop site" and it will load t…

I just turn around and go to Google’s reviews.

Same here, I found Yelp's reviews & rating become more and more irrelevant to real quality over time.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#132

Post by scarface74 »

wtvanhest wrote: post #119
unfunco wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that's the gist of what was being said, and I don't think I've ever seen anyone quote themselves so tawdrily before today.

Updated, but seriously, the Steve Jobs quote is tired. Dropbox is a legit company with a good product. They are as much of a company as Apple was with just a niche computer product. Steve Jobs made the comment because he probably realized that storage was a big business and he also realized that Dropbox is a direct competitor with iCloud. Apple out performed Dropbox, but Dropbox is certainly a real company.

They aren’t profitable and don’t have a clear road to profitability. They may have a “good product” but if they can’t make a profit, by definition, they aren’t a good company.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#133

Post by troydavis »

Developers who have been asked to implement a UX dark pattern like this one (or Yelp’s decision to forcibly open the App Store without warning in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20625852), did you implement it? Why or why not?

I can’t imagine a case where I would be skilled enough to obtain employment at Yelp, and thus at other companies too, and yet would agree to implement something particularly slimy instead of quitting.

Obviously some people make different decisions, though. If you worked at a well-known company when they implemented an intentionally deceptive darkpattern, perhaps others can learn from your experience.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#134

Post by joncrane »

jaclaz wrote: post #94
Mikeb85 wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except in this case there's a million anecdotal stories about Yelp doing this. I've been in the restaurant industry a long time, I've taken calls from Yelp sales agents, they're shit. And their sales pitch basically is extortion (pay us to hide your bad reviews, or else). I've seen owners straight up tell them to fuck off. Thankfully they have zero traction here; my last place had a 4.5 rating on Google with 250+ rev…

JFYI: http://www.bottobistro.com/YELP.html

This is hilarious and great. The whole website is really funny.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#135

Post by scarface74 »

wtvanhest wrote: post #78
hyperbovine wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Steve Jobs FTW yet again. I thought he was wrong about Dropbox for the longest time. But their latest attempts at "productizing" their service (Adobe / Zoom / Slack / Atlassian / Google Docs / Office integrations, "social" features, etc. etc.) have convinced me that simple file sync, which is all I ever wanted from them, is not enough to sustain a company. Meanwhile the shareholder-induced march downwards continues.

Everything is just a product over a long enough time scale

The quote is they are not a product they are a feature.

File syncing and storage is just a feature that Microsoft and Google give away as part of their other offerings.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#136

Post by drucik »

elliekelly wrote: post #113
master-litty wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fascinating. I totally fell for the drama and didn't realize it. Thanks for posting that link. A good reminder to be critical about what you hear.

I don't use Yelp so my opinions are both irrelevant and formed entirely by what I've heard from others. I'm not sure I believe Yelp hides/shows reviews based on whether businesses are willing to pay but I'm not sure I put too much weight in the above posted link either. If Yelp's review algorithm has nothing to do with advertising spend then it should be fairly easy to have someone from PwC/Deloitte/E&Y look at the a…

In my experience audits done by big 4 are worth nothing. Irregularities are raised, and handled, unofficially, so when the report comes, everything is fine, everything’s legit.

That’s what you get when auditing companies also do consulting.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#137

Post by ilikehurdles »

shkkmo wrote: post #121
ilikehurdles wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.yelp-support.com/article/Does-Yelp-extort-small-... I've kind of gotten tired of diving into the whole "yelp extorted my brother's cousin's friend's coworker's business for better ratings" anecdotal story schtick so I'm just going to link the above -- or are you suggesting they're getting away with lying on official communication? If yelp is altering reviews for paying clients, please show the evidence as…

> or are you suggesting they're getting away with lying on official communication? They've probably carefully avoided lying while still being as misleading as possible. > If yelp is altering reviews for paying clients, please show the evidence yelp may not alter the reviews themselves, but it does change the sorting of reviews and images for paying customers. Also the willingness/capability to carry through on the th…

> Do you really think none of those sales people might have deliberately mislead businesses about impact of purchasing advertising on reviews? It may or may not have been condoned by Yelp, but it almost certainly happened.

I really don't disagree with this having happened or it being possible that the culture/leadership turns a blind eye to it. My issue is that there is this oft-repeated claim that paying clients' selection, ranking, or content of reviews is somehow different from non-paying ones. It shouldn't be hard to study this claim and yet there is no evidence of it being true.

I've been to Baraka Cafe. It's great. Take a look at their "not currently recommended" reviews. As has been mentioned elsewhere, almost all (8 out of every 10) reviewers have 0 friends on yelp. Active accounts' reviews get preferential visibility.

Perhaps if I start a business and tell all my friends and family to create accounts and review it with 5 stars, I too will have evidence of yelp "altering" reviews when theirs are inevitably hidden for looking suspicious.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#138

Post by fma »

sundayedition wrote: post #5

I've found Google Maps review quality and quantity improved over the last few years so it's rare that I'd even open Yelp in recent months. With this, I'm deleting my Yelp app.

I like Google Reviews too and use it more than Yelp. Especially when Yelp forces me to download the app.

But I find it difficult to generate a link directly to Google reviews for a particular place... I can link to the Google maps results, but a review page by itself to read/write reviews would be nice.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#139

Post by alephnan »

habosa wrote: post #61

Yelp 5 years ago was a truly valuable service. You could go anywhere (in America) and find good food. Then they lost focus. The app has not improved an ounce since then (seriously why is 'open now' not a default filter) and they've spent a lot of time doing shady things or complaining about other companies. They've tried to get into reservations, delivery, and non-food services but with half-assed attempts at each. T…

It incorporated elements of delight, too, like a rocket ship that showed when you scrolled the page. I feel these lighthearted things are symptomatic of a product-driven culture, or at least a culture that empowered engineers to add Easter eggs. Now that its sales driven, I’m not sure that jives well with recruiting engineering talent.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#140

Post by nrmitchi »

troydavis wrote: post #133

Developers who have been asked to implement a UX dark pattern like this one (or Yelp’s decision to forcibly open the App Store without warning in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20625852 ), did you implement it? Why or why not? I can’t imagine a case where I would be skilled enough to obtain employment at Yelp, and thus at other companies too, and yet would agree to implement something particularly slimy instead…

While I haven't implemented anything like this, and have pushed back when I've seen dark patterns like this before, it's not hard to imagine a situation where someone would feel like they have to.

It's a fairly privileged position to be able to just up and quit. Even in the bay area where you can in theory get another job fairly quickly, not everyone has enough savings to bridge a gap, and health insurance I'm sure could play a part. Not even mentioning what I'm sure is the most common reason of all: predatory visa statuses that are tied to an employer. Ie, you quit, you have to leave the country "immediately".

Edit to add: Perhaps this is just another reason why having high skilled visas and work statuses tied to a specific employer is not the right answer.

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