Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut • Hacker News Board

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#101

Post by lazerwalker » Tue, Aug 06, 2019, 4:08 PM UTC

hyperbovine wrote: post #46

scarface74 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To quote Jobs about Dropbox - Yelp is a feature not a product.

Steve Jobs FTW yet again. I thought he was wrong about Dropbox for the longest time. But their latest attempts at "productizing" their service (Adobe / Zoom / Slack / Atlassian / Google Docs / Office integrations, "social" features, etc. etc.) have convinced me that simple file sync, which is all I ever wanted from them, is not enough to sustain a company. Meanwhile the shareholder-induced march downwards continues.

I wouldn't necessarily frame that as an inevitability of Dropbox as a product, as much as an inevitability of the traditional VC funding model.

It's likely you could build a very healthy business selling people file syncing — I personally use a tiny minimalist Dropbox competitor that seems to be doing just fine. The hypergrowth demanded by investors when you take on $1.7B in funding is what's the challenge.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#102

Post by ajross » Tue, Aug 06, 2019, 4:08 PM UTC

hyperbovine wrote: post #46

scarface74 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To quote Jobs about Dropbox - Yelp is a feature not a product.

Steve Jobs FTW yet again. I thought he was wrong about Dropbox for the longest time. But their latest attempts at "productizing" their service (Adobe / Zoom / Slack / Atlassian / Google Docs / Office integrations, "social" features, etc. etc.) have convinced me that simple file sync, which is all I ever wanted from them, is not enough to sustain a company. Meanwhile the shareholder-induced march downwards continues.

Simple file sync is a plenty big enough market to sustain "a" company. Just not one with Dropbox's valuation. The lesson is about investor overreach, not whether or not there was an economic need being filled.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#103

Post by ViViDboarder » Tue, Aug 06, 2019, 4:08 PM UTC

elliekelly wrote: post #47

I'm curious whether Yelp is only doing this in states without two-party consent to record. In the article the author (Yelp user/restaurant customer) is told the line is recorded before being connected through but the restaurant employee on the other end appears completely unaware. I would guess there are at least a few Attorneys General who would take issue with this approach. It's not even close to the shadiest part…

The article states that Grubhub is recording the calls.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#104

Post by ViViDboarder » Tue, Aug 06, 2019, 4:09 PM UTC

s17n wrote: post #21

Yelp should obviously have just been upfront that they were going to be taking commissions, the fact that they weren't strikes me as symptomatic of a dysfunctional org (that failed to actually align on this decision but pushed it out anyway in a shady way).

Grubhub is taking the commission from the restaurant in this case.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#105

Post by antisthenes » Tue, Aug 06, 2019, 4:10 PM UTC

makerofspoons wrote: post #37

sundayedition wrote: post #5

I've found Google Maps review quality and quantity improved over the last few years so it's rare that I'd even open Yelp in recent months. With this, I'm deleting my Yelp app.

Their CEO was on NPR recently complaining about how Google Maps was eating their lunch and how it wasn't fair.

He's free to find the Google Campus on Google Maps and leave it a 1-star review.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#106

Post by JoeAltmaier » Tue, Aug 06, 2019, 4:12 PM UTC

briandear wrote: post #19

leroy_masochist wrote: post #6

I'm no lawyer, but to my layman's eyes this has class action lawsuit written all over it. Would love to hear an actual tort attorney's perspective on this.

Very hard to prove damages. You would have to prove the calls that you didn’t receive and sales that didn’t happen. There also isn’t any particular “wrong” that has happened unless the restaurant paid money to have a listing and in the terms of that listing there was a clause that required GrubHub not be used. But essentially, paying for Yelp is paying for the service of lead generation which seems to be the exact se…

GrubHub is not involved at all - the equivalent of shaking down people in line. They didn't market anything. They didn't take the order. They just shoved in line and insisted people pay them for … nothing. I can easily see this being a class-action lawsuit.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#107

Post by unfunco » Tue, Aug 06, 2019, 4:12 PM UTC

wtvanhest wrote: post #78

hyperbovine wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Steve Jobs FTW yet again. I thought he was wrong about Dropbox for the longest time. But their latest attempts at "productizing" their service (Adobe / Zoom / Slack / Atlassian / Google Docs / Office integrations, "social" features, etc. etc.) have convinced me that simple file sync, which is all I ever wanted from them, is not enough to sustain a company. Meanwhile the shareholder-induced march downwards continues.

Everything is just a product over a long enough time scale

I don't think that's the gist of what was being said, and I don't think I've ever seen anyone quote themselves so tawdrily before today.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#108

Post by heartbreak » Tue, Aug 06, 2019, 4:13 PM UTC

ilikehurdles wrote: post #24

kadabra9 wrote: post #12

Yelp is such a slimy company. First they wall off their mobile web reviews to try to force you to download their POS app, they have the whole extortion racket going trying to strongarm restaurants into paying for advertising, and now this. Friendly reminder - if you are on mobile and trying to read a Yelp review and don't want to download their app, simply hold refresh, click "request desktop site" and it will load t…

https://www.yelp-support.com/article/Does-Yelp-extort-small-... I've kind of gotten tired of diving into the whole "yelp extorted my brother's cousin's friend's coworker's business for better ratings" anecdotal story schtick so I'm just going to link the above -- or are you suggesting they're getting away with lying on official communication? If yelp is altering reviews for paying clients, please show the evidence as…

It's not Yelp directly, it's their outside sales contractors. Anyone who manages the online presence of a small business can contribute corroboratory anecdotes, including me. Yelp encourages this behavior from their contractors.

I'm sorry that no one has formally studied Yelp's shady business practices, because that leaves us without data you find worthy of consumption. Maybe an enterprising law firm will change that once they smell enough blood in the water.

Until then, consider that swaying someone's opinion on Yelp using their own PR resources is a complete waste of everyone's time.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#109

Post by ajross » Tue, Aug 06, 2019, 4:13 PM UTC

futureastronaut wrote: post #91

sundayedition wrote: post #5

I've found Google Maps review quality and quantity improved over the last few years so it's rare that I'd even open Yelp in recent months. With this, I'm deleting my Yelp app.

Google Maps is also shoving Grubhub down our throats. Every time I try to call a restaurant's phone numer in the new Maps app, I end up accidentally opening a Grubhub tab in Chrome.

I... can't confirm this at all. Opened maps, clicked on a restaurant, selected "call", and brought up the phone app. The only way I can get to a delivery provider is to click a button marked "Delivery". And even there it seems to be suggesting DoorDash to me, even for restaurants that I can find listed on GrubHub's site.

Re: Yelp Is Replacing Restaurants’ Phone Numbers So Grubhub Can Take a Cut

#110

Post by ghostbrainalpha » Tue, Aug 06, 2019, 4:14 PM UTC

Scoundreller wrote: post #29

kadabra9 wrote: post #12

Yelp is such a slimy company. First they wall off their mobile web reviews to try to force you to download their POS app, they have the whole extortion racket going trying to strongarm restaurants into paying for advertising, and now this. Friendly reminder - if you are on mobile and trying to read a Yelp review and don't want to download their app, simply hold refresh, click "request desktop site" and it will load t…

I just turn around and go to Google’s reviews.

Google also sells your direct links to "Buy Tickets" and your phone number to 3rd party affiliates that will take a cut without your permission.

I've been fighting for almost a year to get links in our profile pointed back to our website for a website with more than 1 Million hits a year and a 30k Google Ad spend.