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Google Employee Alleges Discrimination Against Pregnant Women in Viral Memo

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Re: Google Employee Alleges Discrimination Against Pregnant Women in Viral Memo

#131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yes, exactly. the whole point of layers of management is to insulate upper managers from the decisions they make, particularly those that slight the customer or the front-line worker. a more generous phrasing would be that insolation allows managers to take emotions out of a situation to make the most rational decisions for the business (and its shareholders). in any case, direct relationships are a big deal for soci…

I think that's a side effect, not the primary reason for introducing layers of management. The real reason is, you just can't scale am organization without it. Managers are there for enforcing accountability. If directors have few enough reports to enforce accountability on their own, there is no need for a manager.

adding management layers is just one way to solve the coordination problem caused by scaling (which you do because you think the business can become more profitable). you can also scale a business horizontally rather than vertically, but that doesn't have the property of shielding executives from their decisions, nor of centrally controlling information (which allows them to capture more of the value produced by the firm). vertical scaling is preferred by managers for these properties, not because it's how you must scale.

Re: Google Employee Alleges Discrimination Against Pregnant Women in Viral Memo

#132
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean by "internal social justice" stuff?

It's code for anything that is unrelated to straight white males. Edit: Tell me I'm wrong lol.

Don't you see that you're reinforcing the image that "SJWs hate straight white males"?

Re: Google Employee Alleges Discrimination Against Pregnant Women in Viral Memo

#133
post #4

I've spent most entire career at relatively small companies (25-100 employees). I've never seen these types of issues (I can't say they've never happened, I'm just not aware of any). In fact, reading these stories is probably why I've never had the desire to apply to work at any of the large tech companies. I can't say for certain what the differences are, but I think smaller companies tend of have less office politi…

It happened to me at Tudor Investment in NYC, which only has about 200 employees. I tried to quit when my daughter was born as I had found a better job anyways. If I didn't stay an extra 3 months, my manager threatened to fire me 'with cause' so they could enforce my non-compete without paying me in New York. So there I was working through some of the most incompetent shit from my dismal colleagues while my wife was…

[deleted]

Re: Google Employee Alleges Discrimination Against Pregnant Women in Viral Memo

#134
post #75
post #3

Changing internal Google policies isn't enough. America needs stronger worker protection laws.

The United States, Suriname, Papua New Guinea, and a few island countries in the Pacific Ocean are the only countries in the United Nations that do not require employers to provide paid time off for new parents.[1] Parental leave policies in the United Nations [2] [1] https://www.npr.org/2016/10/06/495839588/countries-around-th... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parental_leave#Americas

> require employers to provide paid time off

This isn't phrased quite accurately; I know that in Canada maternity leave is guaranteed by law but it is not paid for at all by the employer (it is paid by government insurance schemes instead).

Re: Google Employee Alleges Discrimination Against Pregnant Women in Viral Memo

#135
post #4

I've spent most entire career at relatively small companies (25-100 employees). I've never seen these types of issues (I can't say they've never happened, I'm just not aware of any). In fact, reading these stories is probably why I've never had the desire to apply to work at any of the large tech companies. I can't say for certain what the differences are, but I think smaller companies tend of have less office politi…

Disclaimer: I work at Google, but this kind of stories reach me mostly via memes.

Google has about 100k employees and this kind of shite seems to happen a couple times a year. Let's assume once a month. This gives an incidence rate of 0.000012 per person per year. Meaning that at 100 employees, plugging into [1], after a 100 year career in a place as bad as Google you would have a 10% chance of that happening at your company.

Assuming only 1% of what happened is known, you would get a 36% chance.

[1]: https://planetcalc.com/5390/

Re: Google Employee Alleges Discrimination Against Pregnant Women in Viral Memo

#136
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Odds are you had some male software engineers. Did management forbid you to hire any that were married, cohabiting, or considering the possibility? Or did the big aerospace company not insure families?

I've been asked in interviews about my familial status, even had one CTO flat-out tell me he wanted to know because of insurance costs.

For the record, asking such questions in a job interview is illegal.

Though it definitely still happens. Probably a lot.

Re: Google Employee Alleges Discrimination Against Pregnant Women in Viral Memo

#137
post #13

I'm always amazed Google management tolerates things like internal message boards aimed at letting employees create Memes on company time. On the "evil point haired boss" level it seems these types of things like their internal message boards cause a lot of trouble for the company. On the less evil side it seems like employees waste a lot of time on these internal sites and all the internal social justice stuff. Mayb…

> I'm always amazed Google management tolerates things like internal message boards aimed at letting employees create Memes on company time.

They have to by law. If they don't take active measures to prevent their employees from talking about non-work things during work, which they don't, then by law they aren't allowed to prevent them from organizing for better working conditions during work.

Re: Google Employee Alleges Discrimination Against Pregnant Women in Viral Memo

#138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The workplace was always politicized. It's just being politicized in different ways now.

I.. disagree. At least here in Sweden, the workplace was and is a neutral place when it comes to politics (basically, it's considered extremely impolite to push your private political view at work.). Is it different in the US?

There's no such thing as a "neutral" place. What's happening is you tend to align with the predominate views at your company, and anyone who doesn't keeps their head down. From you point of view it looks neutral, but actually other views are being repressed.

Re: Google Employee Alleges Discrimination Against Pregnant Women in Viral Memo

#139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Never tested but I've heard from colleagues that noncompetes without payments at the base salary level are not considered "reasonable" and would be not be enforceable in New York state. Of course that's the whole schtick with hedge funds and the like, keep the base salary lower and pay bonuses.

If you're terminated 'for cause', they are supposedly enforceable without pay in New York. Then you have to argue that their 'cause' was invalid, which takes time and lawyers.

Can one still be fired after already having quit (I suppose that might vary from state to state)?

Re: Google Employee Alleges Discrimination Against Pregnant Women in Viral Memo

#140
> Exactly two years ago today, another, much different memo, went internally viral at Google. That one was written by the now infamous James Damore, an engineer who wrote a 10,000-word, unscientific memo attempting to argue that women are naturally less disposed to be good engineers compared to men. The purpose of that memo was to get Google to scale back its diversity efforts.

That's not what actually happened.

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