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Terminating Service for 8Chan

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Re: Terminating Service for 8Chan

#891

Post by cat199 »

yardie wrote: post #648
zimpenfish wrote: post #518

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They choose not to apply this approach to white supremacy. "[...] the measures taken against ISIS were so extreme that, if applied to white supremacy, there would certainly be backlash, because algorithms would obviously flag content that has been tweeted by prominent Republicans—or, at the very least, their supporters." https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/a3xgq5/why-wont-twitter-t...

Honestly, they should have done exactly that. Flag their content and ban them. Then go to the capitol. And when some politician asks, "why was I banned?" Tell them honestly, your statements were determined to be extremist by the same algorithm that bans Al Qaeda and ISIS from posting. Then sit back and watch the real fireworks go off. Just because they have a political title does not mean we have to respect anything…

And what happens to the progressive dems when you cross feed stalin? pot==kettle

Re: Terminating Service for 8Chan

#892

Post by Ajedi32 »

awinder wrote: post #855
Ajedi32 wrote: post #820

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is a CDN a "smart pipe" but DNS is not? That seems like a rather arbitrary distinction to me. Is the internet not a "knowledge/information utility"? Do CDNs not provide critical protection against DDOS attacks? How then does denying service not "prevent 8chan from delivering it's message"?

CDNs are not the only way to provide protection against DDOS, they're a packaged offering combining multiple technologies but there's nothing preventing you from running geolocated servers, on multiple providers, with ddos mitigation you buy/build yourself. Blocking at the DNS layer (through multi-party action I guess) is going to be an insurmountable hurdle. Wanting cloudflare or any other company to offer you prero…

Maybe not strictly insurmountable. But building your own massively distributed infrastructure capable of resisting DDOS attacks is expensive. Perhaps prohibitively so, depending on the size of your budget.

You could just as easily argue that since DNS blocks can technically be overcome by directing users to a specific IP address, or by using an alternate name server infrastructure like Namecoin, that DNS isn't critical.

In my opinion, the distinction is rather blurry.

Re: Terminating Service for 8Chan

#893

Post by mythrwy »

Cakez0r wrote: post #684
IntelMiner wrote: post #474

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As opposed to...what, exactly? A government funded Reddit? Which government would fund it? How would it be run?

The government could fund educational programs to teach people to think critically about the content they see on the internet, then they wouldn't have to censor it.

The government already provides 12 years of (somewhat) compulsory education.

Critical thinking skills still seem to be a rarity.

Re: Terminating Service for 8Chan

#894

Post by raxxorrax »

andygates wrote: post #704
Iv wrote: post #79

Tor's onion service will always there to provide hosting to the less popular ideas. The censorship-resistant network is there. Make sure to give it some love. Last time I checked, people were discussing how to murder, exchanging nazi manifestos and conspiracy theories. I was looking for anarchist discussions but I actually ended up having these on reddit. Don't get fooled by the current positioning of IT firms, it on…

This isn't about silencing the bad actors, it's about muffling them enough that they don't contaminate daily discourse. Fine: let them be on onion boards. We know de-platforming works.

You think the situation improved in recent years? Seriously? That aside, I happily muffle the discourse of anyone in favor of deplatforming, since I have seen that used against completely innocent people from some cliques that think they own the place. But don't mind me.

Re: Terminating Service for 8Chan

#895

Post by agensaequivocum »

bart_spoon wrote: post #814

I'm not sure I understand what those here rallying in defense of "free speech" are arguing. Free speech has not been violated. The government did not mandate this. As an individual citizen, I am allowed to say whatever I want under the protection of free speech. But I am not entitled to others providing me a platform for my speech. Other people/companies can't be coerced to provide me such a platform. And even if eve…

I agree. Similarly, I cannot be forced at gunpoint by the government to provide a cake for a gay wedding if I have a moral objection.

Re: Terminating Service for 8Chan

#896

Post by amaccuish »

partiallypro wrote: post #878
ajross wrote: post #473

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The shooters in Poway, Christchurch and El Paso didn't post their screeds via Tor, and weren't radicalized on onion sites. They went to 8chan, because that was more easily understood, widely accessed, and had a larger community. It's the community that matters here, not the technology. The issue isn't whether or not it's possible for two nutjobs to converse in some way, obviously they can. It's whether or not there i…

Those communities will just be driven underground, more than likely, to Tor sites and be much harder to track. At least once 4Chan and 8Chan are pushed out.

Well no one is clearly tracking these people now when they post out in the open on *chan, so I'm not sure whether this is really such a problem.

Re: Terminating Service for 8Chan

#897

Post by shard972 »

folbec wrote: post #679
CM30 wrote: post #656

I don't like 8chan as a website, but I'm still not a fan of this move. Feels like no one online wants to just provide a 'dumb pipe', and always want to act like a pseudo publisher trying to dictate what's allowed and what isn't. Imagine if real life utilities did this. If because someone used your property for offensive purposes, the water company cut off the water supply, or the electricity company refused to provid…

As a private company, as long as they are not a monopoly or a quasi monopoly( ), they can do what they want, no restriction. ( ) My personnal definition is a minimum of 4-6 participant in any market with at least 5%-10% share each (Exemple : France has some of the lowest mobile telephony fares in the world, because there are 4 "biggish" providers (one is over 50%), and they are often trying to merge "to regain pricin…

oh yep im sure cloudflare is under 10% market share and there are plenty of other competitors that are just biting at the chomp to host 8chan

Re: Terminating Service for 8Chan

#898

Post by x86_64Ubuntu »

Ajedi32 wrote: post #837
bart_spoon wrote: post #814

I'm not sure I understand what those here rallying in defense of "free speech" are arguing. Free speech has not been violated. The government did not mandate this. As an individual citizen, I am allowed to say whatever I want under the protection of free speech. But I am not entitled to others providing me a platform for my speech. Other people/companies can't be coerced to provide me such a platform. And even if eve…

As has been explained in this thread multiple times now, Free Speech is a principle, not a law. If, for example, someone in North Korea spoke against their government and was executed for it, that'd be a violation of Free Speech. Arguing "but North Korea doesn't have a law protecting people who speak against the government" would be ridiculous. Similarly, if a person or organization in the United States is silenced b…

I'm always amazed at how right wingers are all "property rights, property rights". And when something like this happens, they quickly switch from demanding that the property rights of CloudFlare be observed, to "free speech, free speech" concerning the conservatives on 8chan.

Re: Terminating Service for 8Chan

#899

Post by sv123 »

agensaequivocum wrote: post #895
bart_spoon wrote: post #814

I'm not sure I understand what those here rallying in defense of "free speech" are arguing. Free speech has not been violated. The government did not mandate this. As an individual citizen, I am allowed to say whatever I want under the protection of free speech. But I am not entitled to others providing me a platform for my speech. Other people/companies can't be coerced to provide me such a platform. And even if eve…

I agree. Similarly, I cannot be forced at gunpoint by the government to provide a cake for a gay wedding if I have a moral objection.

Discriminatory business practices should not be conflated with free speech.

Re: Terminating Service for 8Chan

#900

Post by partiallypro »

amaccuish wrote: post #896
partiallypro wrote: post #878

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those communities will just be driven underground, more than likely, to Tor sites and be much harder to track. At least once 4Chan and 8Chan are pushed out.

Well no one is clearly tracking these people now when they post out in the open on *chan, so I'm not sure whether this is really such a problem.

It's pretty obvious that they are, it's hard to track something that's anonymous. It's not like the 80s/90s when these people would congregate in groups and go to parties, etc. This is a new ball game. You also have to consider that *Channers often "shitpost" and 99% of threats aren't even legitimate.
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