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“Culture fit” is a two way street (2018)

rachelbythebay.com

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Re: “Culture fit” is a two way street (2018)

#61
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Cuture fit is a blank check to fail a person's interview just because you didn't like them in the first 30 seconds. I hear this all the time. Yeah, that might be true in some cases, but it's also valid in quite a lot of instances (like the example you provided). > it is categorically impossible to establish in a 45 minute interview whether a person is actually a "fit" or not I've run/sat in on several trainwreck in…

1/4 is homophobic.

No matter what your sexuality, it's not appropriate to bring it up in an interview.

Nor in the workplace. That's how sexual harassment happens.

Re: “Culture fit” is a two way street (2018)

#62
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1/4 is homophobic.

No matter what your sexuality, it's not appropriate to bring it up in an interview. Nor in the workplace. That's how sexual harassment happens.

No, we should aim for people to live their authentic lives. If people cannot live their truths then society has failed.

Re: “Culture fit” is a two way street (2018)

#63
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Cuture fit is a blank check to fail a person's interview just because you didn't like them in the first 30 seconds. I hear this all the time. Yeah, that might be true in some cases, but it's also valid in quite a lot of instances (like the example you provided). > it is categorically impossible to establish in a 45 minute interview whether a person is actually a "fit" or not I've run/sat in on several trainwreck in…

1/4 is homophobic.

No, it's not. That comment being inappropriate had nothing to do with the candidate's sexual preference. It had to do with a candidate making an inappropriate sexual remark during an interview.

If the comment was "X women do it better" it would still be inappropriate.

Ironically, the HR staff member present during the interview was a gay man himself. I guess he must be homophobic in your eyes also for discarding the application?

Re: “Culture fit” is a two way street (2018)

#65

This is a great post and so spot on. At some point in my career my 'review prep' (which was the time I spent working on my own evaluation of my year at a company) became answering the question, "Do I still want to work here?" I categorize my 'review' in four sections (which are each rated at one of five levels, needs improvement, sometimes meets expectations, meets expectations, sometimes exceeds expectations, or con…

This comment is wonderful. As a company founder (and de-facto CEO), I'd love it if all of my employees did this every year (or even continuously!). I think I am going to steal this and make it part of an annual review process (once we get big enough to have those).

I did notice however that one thing that isn't your list is your salary. I'm curious if that was intentional or not?

Re: “Culture fit” is a two way street (2018)

#66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Molly is a drug, so basically they said they got high all weekend. I don't have a problem with it personally, but a lot of workplaces do.

To be absolutely fair, being all into drugs myself - if someone actually used a phrase “I danced at a festival with my friend molly”, I would absolutely never want to spend my time with them again. That literally is the trashiest thing you can ever say.

What's your definition of trashy here if its not simply using drugs?

Re: “Culture fit” is a two way street (2018)

#67

This is a great post and so spot on. At some point in my career my 'review prep' (which was the time I spent working on my own evaluation of my year at a company) became answering the question, "Do I still want to work here?" I categorize my 'review' in four sections (which are each rated at one of five levels, needs improvement, sometimes meets expectations, meets expectations, sometimes exceeds expectations, or con…

I completely agree with this, but I often find that not everyone is in the same position to jump ship easily. Your attitude is often espoused by highly talented individual that could basically "work wherever". A personal anecdote from someone I work with. "Alice" is a technical project manager at a large company. She's been with the company 8 years. While she's been in the role, expectations on her have been unclear,…

That is absolutely true, and in the original article there was a mention of folks trapped by US visa rules (leave your job, go back to your origin country).

To address your question though, if I were mentoring Alice I would ask which is more important to her, money or happiness? I learned long ago that it is useless to argue which is more important but it instructive to know in a person which one is key.

If she thinks happiness is more important, then the advice would be to interview elsewhere for a spot where she could be happy and ignore the salary if it is sufficient to her to live on. If she thinks money is more important, then the advice would be to focus her personal development toward being able to demand the salary that she wants to be paid.

The bottom line is that its easier to put up with poor working conditions when it is simply a stepping stone toward a different (ideally less poor) place.

Re: “Culture fit” is a two way street (2018)

#68
post #65

This is a great post and so spot on. At some point in my career my 'review prep' (which was the time I spent working on my own evaluation of my year at a company) became answering the question, "Do I still want to work here?" I categorize my 'review' in four sections (which are each rated at one of five levels, needs improvement, sometimes meets expectations, meets expectations, sometimes exceeds expectations, or con…

This comment is wonderful. As a company founder (and de-facto CEO), I'd love it if all of my employees did this every year (or even continuously!). I think I am going to steal this and make it part of an annual review process (once we get big enough to have those). I did notice however that one thing that isn't your list is your salary. I'm curious if that was intentional or not?

Salary as a variable has changed over time;

Initially of course there was a minimum to meet my goals. My target was to be able to live somewhere, cover my cost of living, pay down my debts, and save 10% of my salary in long term savings.

Then as expenses started moving from being "in the future" to being "in the past" I was able to be more flexible on salary.

It helps that I have never equated what I was paid with how much I was "worth." It also helps that I don't have a lot of innate materialism. Although the funny story there is when I went back to Los Angeles to visit my old roommate from college I was showing him a fancy laptop that I had saved up for an bought. He had a pretty crap laptop but had recently bought a nice late model Mercedes Benz. Meanwhile, I had a 10 year old car at that point. We laughed at how the two different areas of California encouraged different status symbols.

Re: “Culture fit” is a two way street (2018)

#69

The company I work for definitely hires people who are not a "culture fit" and our company is better for it. People who bring different perspective make your products stronger.

I think the word "culture" is overloaded, such that it's really hard to talk about and you can make it mean whatever you want, but there's a use for it that I don't know a better way to describe in a word. Yes, there is "culture fit" in terms of things that don't matter, and where it does good to push a company outside of a comfort zone in order to get the best people and new perspectives.

But at a certain point, you need to get alignment between what work you find rewarding/fulfilling/exciting and what work a company tends to recognize and reward. This essay I think gets at the heart of it:

http://yosefk.com/blog/people-can-read-their-managers-mind.h...

If you are a programmer, which kind of organization do you think you would tend to want to work at, all things being equal: one where the organization's culture is set by people who come from programming backgrounds or sales backgrounds? It's not the same answer as if you were a salesperson. (And of course, there are programmers who probably prefer the culture at a place driven by salespeople, and vice versa. And you can start to think about why that might be.)

As an employee, what a good culture fit means is "someplace that values and rewards the things I want to be doing." As an employer, a good culture fit is someone who responds well to the incentives you have in place for them. Sometimes, cultures are just objectively bad; anywhere that judges programmers by how many lines of code they write alone is establishing perverse incentives. But sometimes cultures are not better or worse objectively, just different. Some people work better in a research culture and some people work better in a product culture, for instance. That's fine. But that's where finding out if you and an employee are a culture fit can benefit both parties, not just be an excuse to hire only people you like. It's not about beliefs, it's about what work is valued and how it's valued.

Re: “Culture fit” is a two way street (2018)

#70

This is a great post and so spot on. At some point in my career my 'review prep' (which was the time I spent working on my own evaluation of my year at a company) became answering the question, "Do I still want to work here?" I categorize my 'review' in four sections (which are each rated at one of five levels, needs improvement, sometimes meets expectations, meets expectations, sometimes exceeds expectations, or con…

Is this something you've always done or only something you've done as you've gained higher level positions? I'm imagining that compensation is always at some minimum satisfactory level as well (and it must be rather high unless you're wealthy or bought a home decades ago or live in some really LCOL area?). Do you only work at places that you truly want to work at from the get go?

I can't imagine implementing this at an IC level at a startup. (Which is where I've been mostly) I could see it at some places where you could switch teams in a big company and not deal with those same people again. (thus not having to reinterview fully) I've found that people will change their ways very rarely unless your loss would ruin them. They're much happier to lose ICs than change.

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