Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't know about the US but here in the UK paying someone for a coding test is actually not as simple as it sounds. If you employ someone, even just for a half day test, you have to do a "Right to work" assessment ( https://www.gov.uk/check-job-applicant-right-to-work ) which can take up a lot of time. It's a pain in the *&^%. At my company we give candidates something to cover any expenses they've had to pay to at…
You just pay them a flat-rate expense reimbursement. Tadaa, problem fixed! I hate companies cowaring behind rigid interpretations of rules to get out of paying people.
Why Developers Hate Coding Skills Tests and What Hiring Managers Can Do
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Re: Why Developers Hate Coding Skills Tests and What Hiring Managers Can Do
#32Earlier quoted context omitted.
You just pay them a flat-rate expense reimbursement. Tadaa, problem fixed! I hate companies cowaring behind rigid interpretations of rules to get out of paying people.
But there is tax limit on flat reimbursements that is considerably lower than the actual cost in almost all cases (think €20 for a night in a hotel). Following your advice is actually a criminal offence (tax evasion).
Re: Why Developers Hate Coding Skills Tests and What Hiring Managers Can Do
#33I like coding tests. They give me an opportunity to differentiate myself.
Re: Why Developers Hate Coding Skills Tests and What Hiring Managers Can Do
#34These sorts of hiring filters are not something that can be solved for industry wide, because many developers don't want a common solution. Otherwise the solution is simple, because absolutely every other industry has solved this problem.
The solution is universal, objective, screen criteria backed by industry, which is also known as licensing. Using a test prove that developers have required knowledge, can read code (this is the big one), and can make certain basic decisions. In addition to testing also require documented experience from trusted and validated sources, continuing education, and some form of educational baseline (not necessary academic).
Absolutely every other industry has figured this out. Licensing isn't magic and doesn't create talent, but it is an excellent initial filter.
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When looking at potential employers there are two things I look for now: subjectivity and selectivity. If the potential employer is not very about skills assessments I get nervous they are looking for the wrong qualities in applicants such that they may contain a lot of dead weight on their existing teams.
On the other hand if they are selective about skills, but that selection is purely subjective I go from feeling nervous to thinking they are phony. I get the feeling I am on a bad date that will end up as a broken marriage. The hiring party has absolutely no idea what they want, but they have some primitive notions about what they don't want. The common root cause of subjective nonsense is because the hiring party is insecure and seeks to qualify some level of comfort unrelated to the skills tested.
The reason why many developers don't want licensing is because many developers lack the skills necessary to complete such licensing criteria. They would be out of the job. This isn't true just of applicants or aspiring developers, but also true for many people performing hiring.
In a recent interview I had to prove I could read code in a language I have never written in before over the course of about 90 minutes, and it went very well. The goal was to prove I could quickly read/write original logic after getting over some basic syntax. The hiring party knew exactly what they wanted and were very clear in achievement criteria. Everything was pretty objective in that this process was a testing to see how far a candidate could get into a given problem in the time allotted and the effort that candidate would put into refactoring. All other technical qualities were ignored to reduce selective bias.
Re: Why Developers Hate Coding Skills Tests and What Hiring Managers Can Do
#35The take-home asks candidates to complete a basic installation of our product and document what they did in detail. The latter part forces candidates to provide a writing sample in the domain they'd be working in.
The one problem is that the writeup, which I'd find quite useful in evaluating a candidate, is just thrown into the bin as best I can tell. It's not available in our applicant tracking system, and HR doesn't provide it to interviewers along with other interview materials. I'm not actually sure anyone reviews it at all.
Re: Why Developers Hate Coding Skills Tests and What Hiring Managers Can Do
#36Developers hate them because coding tests have devolved into multi-hour, unpaid assignments from which no feedback is given. It's especially bad if they are unwilling (as some seem to be) to have a short phone conversation prior to the coding test to tell you about the project.
Coding test without a chat first is super annoying and something I flat out refuse. If you can't be bothered to invest 30 minutes, don't expect me to put in n hours.
Re: Why Developers Hate Coding Skills Tests and What Hiring Managers Can Do
#37Earlier quoted context omitted.
Coding test without a chat first is super annoying and something I flat out refuse. If you can't be bothered to invest 30 minutes, don't expect me to put in n hours.
Amazon runs codility tests prior to a phone chat.
Re: Why Developers Hate Coding Skills Tests and What Hiring Managers Can Do
#38This always filters out the incompetent from the productive. If we can't survive a day with you in our environment, games over. If however, you survive a day in our environment and still want the job - game on.
Re: Why Developers Hate Coding Skills Tests and What Hiring Managers Can Do
#39On the other hand, 2 hours for a tertiary interview after already spending time out is a reasonably significant investment of time for someone who likely already has a position and which I’d suggest isn’t widely required for positions outside of technology. Certainly no management position has a 2 hour examination on processes or people retention strategies in addition to the usual coffee shop discussion or panel int…
I would not be so certain.
Re: Why Developers Hate Coding Skills Tests and What Hiring Managers Can Do
#40I don't have the will, or energy for that.
I have been working in the area like for the approx. last 2 decades. If anyone wants to validate if I can really code, can put 1 hour of their time and go over my github/gitlab profiles instead of asking 1 hour of my free time to redo what I was doing professionally.
This will be counted against their paid time, but not mine. This is asking some sacrifice on my part for a process everyone knows is highly subjective, and not really doing the expected.
And more to that, while working I solve real problems of the business. I do work with colleagues. I do use as much time as needed to do research. I don't get on a dumb IDE which is not integrated to my workflow, or tooling and do puzzles with illogical limits.