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Cancer patients are being denied drugs, even with prescriptions and insurance

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Re: Cancer patients are being denied drugs, even with prescriptions and insurance

#61

Post by jodrellblank »

cheeky78 wrote: post #46
tasty_freeze wrote: post #36

One entirely maddening thing is that the ACA was labeled as having "death panels" that would decide who lives and dies. That phrase was powerfully effective in making large group of Americans strongly oppose the ACA. Even if they knew nothing else about the ACA, they knew they didn't want death panels. But as this article demonstrates, if we care to use the inflammatory "death panels" label, we already have them. It…

"But as this article demonstrates, if we care to use the inflammatory "death panels" label, we already have them." It's not inflammatory when it's true. When the government runs our healthcare, choices are removed and someone else gets to decide if you should get surgery needed or not...and many times this is life or death. At least now, if a cancer patient gets denied drugs, they can go to another doctor or get a se…

I've lived in countries with universal healthcare and the quality is sub-par compared to the US/private care.

I don't think anyone argues that a royal palace is not a good enough home, the complaint is that only a very very few can live in a royal palace and if that's the country's main form of housing, a lot of homeless people are unhappy with it. You can pay for private healthcare in the UK as well. Pay as much as you like and get as many specialists as you can afford. The NHS doesn't stop that from existing. The NHS is probably lower quality care than that. What the NHS is, is available to everyone. The NHS was built in the 1940s /after/ it was already possible for wealthy people to pay to visit doctors of their own choice. Somehow that didn't translate into healthcare for everyone back in the day, and I'm not aware of any good argument for why it magically will now if we turn the NHS private.(?)

Your elderly relatives in Canada can afford to travel internationally and pay private prices for health care .. so national health care should be dismantled? What about the millions of Canadians who can't afford that, and a long waiting list is better than nothing?

Re: Cancer patients are being denied drugs, even with prescriptions and insurance

#62

Post by IanDrake »

taneq wrote: post #44
tasty_freeze wrote: post #36

One entirely maddening thing is that the ACA was labeled as having "death panels" that would decide who lives and dies. That phrase was powerfully effective in making large group of Americans strongly oppose the ACA. Even if they knew nothing else about the ACA, they knew they didn't want death panels. But as this article demonstrates, if we care to use the inflammatory "death panels" label, we already have them. It…

The rational, informed decision is that the government should run its own medical R&D. But no, we can't do that because muh freedums.

Examples of prodects created by government run medical R&D?

Re: Cancer patients are being denied drugs, even with prescriptions and insurance

#63

Post by threezero »

mevile wrote: post #45

If you're an employer in California and want to choose a provider that will not have to deal with this you might want to consider offering Kaiser to your employees. There's benefits and drawbacks, but one of the big benefits is that they're vertically integrated and the doctors, labs, pharmacies are all part of the same organization. I would think that would help avoid this specific type of situation. The big drawbac…

Kaiser’s system works better than a lot of others, but for me having to drive 40 minutes for a prescription is outrageous when I have 20 other pharmacies in a 15 minute radius.

Re: Cancer patients are being denied drugs, even with prescriptions and insurance

#64

Post by lotsofpulp »

Irene wrote: post #52
taneq wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rational, informed decision is that the government should run its own medical R&D. But no, we can't do that because muh freedums.

My grandmother was denied drugs by government-run healthcare and died in severe pain.

What does that have to do with taxpayer funded R&D for medicine?

Presumably, taneq's point was that medicine owned by taxpayers can be sold at the cost to manufacture and distribute it at far lower costs, as opposed to the current system where the owners of the research also needed to be compensated.

Re: Cancer patients are being denied drugs, even with prescriptions and insurance

#65

Post by someguydave »

alistairSH wrote: post #42
rosser wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was once dating a woman who had vertically contracted Hepatitis C during her birth. We had an accident before I had completed my normal vaccination course. The first-line treatment in those cases is a dose of immunoglobulin containing the relevant antibodies. My insurance gave two choices: pay $800 out of pocket for the drug at any pharmacy that carries it (zero coverage offered, no recourse), take it to my doctor'…

Fine, guys. It's your money... Except it's not their money. It's all of our money, as the whole point of insurance is pooling resources to hedge against any individual risk. Not that I blame you - the implementation of some policies is completely asinine.

The only fair way to distribute rare goods is to the highest bidder

Re: Cancer patients are being denied drugs, even with prescriptions and insurance

#66

Post by hestipod »

monetus wrote: post #60
hestipod wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I've lived in countries with universal healthcare and >the quality is sub-par compared to the US/private care. My experience has been the exact opposite. America's healthcare business ruined my life. As a result I have no insurance and have lost the "privilege" to BUY said American healthcare. I struggle with low income options and programs, all insufficient. The only good care I ever got was in Europe. My experienc…

To add to your anecdote: I have a bill laying around where the asking price for the mri was $21000.

Yeah I was quoted 3500usd cash price recently and that was with the "generous" cash pay/uninsured discount of 10% and a lower income community hospital. Needless to say I did not get the scan. That's how it goes here. I only paid about 150usd in a Central European nation for a more advanced 3d version, and that was in the PRIVATE for-profit system there. American healthcare is a tragedy that I don't see changing sadly since so many people fight any positive change.

Re: Cancer patients are being denied drugs, even with prescriptions and insurance

#67

Post by Scoundreller »

tasty_freeze wrote: post #36

One entirely maddening thing is that the ACA was labeled as having "death panels" that would decide who lives and dies. That phrase was powerfully effective in making large group of Americans strongly oppose the ACA. Even if they knew nothing else about the ACA, they knew they didn't want death panels. But as this article demonstrates, if we care to use the inflammatory "death panels" label, we already have them. It…

Canadian here. We also have decision makers that decide what gets covered or not.

It's stupid not to. We shouldn't plunder health care funds on $1m per year of life saved interventions when you can spend that on 100 interventions costing $10k per year of life saved.

It works pretty well (something like 15th longest life expectancy).

Of course, you're always free to pony up your own cash to pay for a treatment that isn't covered by your insurance, so the individual is always their own final death panel.

Re: Cancer patients are being denied drugs, even with prescriptions and insurance

#68

Post by chroem- »

IanDrake wrote: post #62
taneq wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rational, informed decision is that the government should run its own medical R&D. But no, we can't do that because muh freedums.

Examples of prodects created by government run medical R&D?

Tofacitinib is one that I am familiar with. I am sure there are many more.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tofacitinib

Also, I think it's a valid question that doesn't deserve downvotes.

Re: Cancer patients are being denied drugs, even with prescriptions and insurance

#69

Post by SolarNet »

IanDrake wrote: post #62
taneq wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rational, informed decision is that the government should run its own medical R&D. But no, we can't do that because muh freedums.

Examples of prodects created by government run medical R&D?

NASA alone has plenty of good examples. Enriched baby food, CAT scans, heart replacement devices, better thermometers and imaging, and other minor advancements for specific procedures: better fiber optic devices for baby delivery, better lighting for brain cancer operations, improved cooling devices for certain symptoms. And again that's just specifically medical products that accidentally fell out of a space program.

Re: Cancer patients are being denied drugs, even with prescriptions and insurance

#70

Post by sjg007 »

imglorp wrote: post #19

I'm having exactly these problems, with exactly these companies: CVS and BC Anthem. Doctor writes prescriptions; some are limited in doses, some delayed, some with no copay, some priced barbarically, and some flat out refused. Then the doctor's office has wizards that help advocate and sometimes that works, sometimes there's a delay, and sometimes never. In all cases, the patient suffers. They are already facing a me…

I am surprised that this hasn't started a class action lawsuit yet. The insurer through delays is causing harm. I'm guessing it's a contract thing though. One thing to do is if your plan is regulated by the state then immediately start an appeal with your state's department of insurance. There are also advocates at some hospitals and insurance companies. The other thing to do is go to a very large academic cancer center... presumably a tier 1 research hospital. Outcomes are also better. They usually have staff that know their way through each insurance company and PBM.
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