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Google and Mozilla are failing to support browser extension developers

armin.dev

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Re: Google and Mozilla are failing to support browser extension developers

#41

I've experienced slowness / crashes with FF extensions, as some people have described here, annoyingly the problem doesn't seem to be reproducible. I'd optimally like to have 4-5 plugins maximum - key-driven browsing, adblock, CSS overrides and JavaScript injection. What's the best way to blame / troubleshoot a bad plugin? Because as soon as I add them all I experience 1-2 page crashes/infinity loops per hour

> What's the best way to blame / troubleshoot a bad plugin?

You don't do that if the plugin is provided for free, you can just say "thanks" or "no thanks", just don't use it / develop your own.

Re: Google and Mozilla are failing to support browser extension developers

#42
post #25
post #13

On the one hand, this seems like a real missed opportunity by Mozilla. As Chrome reigns in extensions that conflict with Google's business model, this is a reason to use Firefox. BUT - extensions are also often the cause of a slow and frustrating Firefox experience, which then leads folks to talk about how Chrome is better-performing/faster (I've been guilty of this myself in the past). Mozilla needs to make sure Fir…

> BUT - extensions are also often the cause of a slow and frustrating Firefox experience I doubt that this is true. Some extensions like Adblockers even make browsing faster.

I reset Firefox recently on an ancient Linux laptop and before I got uBlock origin set back up the browser was nearly unusable. I had taken for granted how much it was doing. If I ever get out of this deep financial hole I am sending gorhill a large donation (if he accepts, I recall in the past he wasn't taking any). One of the most, if not THE most useful QOL add-ons in my view.

Re: Google and Mozilla are failing to support browser extension developers

#43
Hi, author here. Certain software may bring greater value for society when it is freely accessible for everyone, without compromising on user privacy, while being partially subsidized by users who can afford to sponsor such projects.

It would benefit us all if browser vendors would enable users to easily support extensions, and do so from a unified user interface, like an extension store.

It sends a different signal for the user when a browser vendor encourages and handles contributions for extensions, instead of leaving developers on their own to build makeshift donation prompts and expect users to give out credit card data or sign up to third-party services just to donate.

Sponsoring your favourite extensions right from your Google or Firefox account would help projects receive more funding, be more user-centered, and further enrich the browser extension ecosystem, while encouraging new developers to publish their own extensions and support user needs.

Re: Google and Mozilla are failing to support browser extension developers

#44
> It is a regular occurrence to hear about open source developers selling their browser extensions, only for their users to be exploited later on by the new owners. ... We are witnessing the failure of browser vendors to recognize the value of our labor and the important role it plays in a healthy browser ecosystem.

So this is an interesting philosophical question - the market value of the extension is the value of "monetizing" it by stuffing ads, or worse, monitoring/tracking/exfiltration, into the extension. It's the market value of the trust of the extension's userbase. Is that the value of the extension developer's labor?

I would argue not really. The value of a bank, for instance, is not the amount of money in all of the vaults. That money is held in trust for customers, and it is not for the owner of the bank to dispose of. Therefore, nobody who makes a fair offer for the bank should expect those resources in the transaction, so a fair market price for the bank is much less - such as the present value of the interest earned by the bank minus the interest returned to customers.

In particular, the only reason the bank has customers is they expect to get their money back, generally with interest, at some point in the future. If they didn't, they'd put their money elsewhere. So if a bank is willing to sell the contents of the customer accounts, that indicates incomplete information in the market - customers didn't know the bank wasn't trustworthy. The true market value of the bank, in a perfect-information market, would be close to zero.

It seems like the problem here is that we know two ways of compensating browser extension developers: "don't" and "breach your users' trust." Those point to wildly undervalued and wildly overvalued estimates of the fair market value of the developers' work. And we should come up with some fairer way to value their work (or, more fundamentally, to compensate them; we may not need to monetize the extension, necessarily) first, and I'm not totally sure it's the fault of browsers for not having had such a clever idea - it seems like we collectively need to figure that out.

Re: Google and Mozilla are failing to support browser extension developers

#45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's pretty clearly in line with Mozilla's goals for an Open Internet -- and from a pragmatic point-of-view a mass exodus of extension developers from Chrome would be big problem for Google. I could see this as a way for Mozilla to further distinguish Firefox from Chrome. If Firefox was seen in the developer community as the platform to target if you want to make money, it won't take long for extension developers to…

> an Open Internet I have no idea what this means, especially capitalized like a brand of some sort, so I don't know how supporting extension developers would help or hinder that. > users would start to shift towards thinking of Firefox as "the one I can extend." Users already thought of firefox as the browser you could extend, but mozilla decided that wasn't a priority. I don't see them suddenly reprioritizing that.

I think that's a bit unfair to Mozilla. They previously had prioritized extensibility over security, that is, extensions and plugins had basically direct access to the browser's C code itself. They've now prioritized security over extensibility. That's not to say that extensibility isn't a priority (or that security was previously not a priority).

Re: Google and Mozilla are failing to support browser extension developers

#46
post #13

On the one hand, this seems like a real missed opportunity by Mozilla. As Chrome reigns in extensions that conflict with Google's business model, this is a reason to use Firefox. BUT - extensions are also often the cause of a slow and frustrating Firefox experience, which then leads folks to talk about how Chrome is better-performing/faster (I've been guilty of this myself in the past). Mozilla needs to make sure Fir…

>BUT - extensions are also often the cause of a slow and frustrating Firefox experience, which then leads folks to talk about how Chrome is better-performing/faster

IE (used to?) have this bottom notification warning about 'X plugin is slowing IE, would you like to disable it?'. Perhaps Firefox should add similar feature and notify users about slow plugins, maybe even with some actual data instead of a vague slowness claim.

Re: Google and Mozilla are failing to support browser extension developers

#47
They're also failing to support users, as hinted by the article. The fact that developers are able to simply hand over control of extensions to a third party, who are going to do god knows what with it, without the user being informed at all, is ridiculous.

I have a few extensions with 10-100,000 users and have received many emails from people asking to buy one. The numbers in the article seem accurate - if you have 100,000 users you could be looking at offers for tens of thousands of dollars. So, it's no surprise that developers cave in and compromise their users' security.

Re: Google and Mozilla are failing to support browser extension developers

#49

I've experienced slowness / crashes with FF extensions, as some people have described here, annoyingly the problem doesn't seem to be reproducible. I'd optimally like to have 4-5 plugins maximum - key-driven browsing, adblock, CSS overrides and JavaScript injection. What's the best way to blame / troubleshoot a bad plugin? Because as soon as I add them all I experience 1-2 page crashes/infinity loops per hour

> What's the best way to blame / troubleshoot a bad plugin? You don't do that if the plugin is provided for free, you can just say "thanks" or "no thanks", just don't use it / develop your own.

I meant respectfully blame, fwiw. If your plugin crashes my browser and I like the plugin, I'll fix it / send a bug report. If I don't like it, or it's beyond repair, I'll uninstall it.

I have way bigger stones I can grind my axe on, if I ever feel the need.

Re: Google and Mozilla are failing to support browser extension developers

#50
post #44

> It is a regular occurrence to hear about open source developers selling their browser extensions, only for their users to be exploited later on by the new owners. ... We are witnessing the failure of browser vendors to recognize the value of our labor and the important role it plays in a healthy browser ecosystem. So this is an interesting philosophical question - the market value of the extension is the value of "…

As an extension developer who recently got one of these offers, your analysis is a good verbalization of my gut feeling on the matter. I turned it down, of course.

While users may feel bad about extension developers not being compensated, I feel like the larger story here is that:

- Companies are buying extensions for nefarious purposes, which presents a huge security risk.

- Evidently, app stores are sufficiently bad at detecting this that it remains profitable.

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