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N.Y.P.D. Adds Children as Young as 11 to Facial Recognition Database

nytimes.com

21–30 of 112 posts

Re: N.Y.P.D. Adds Children as Young as 11 to Facial Recognition Database

#21

I know that this might be an unpopular opinion, but if privacy really is dead, why don't we just make this data public? I know there's significant risks, but I feel like it's a better step forward than having this technology developed and deployed in secret.

We still have our thoughts, for now.

We should at least know when our face is being accessed on demand and in some ai process. Same with our data.

We'll get there eventually but there will be lots of issues along the way.

Re: N.Y.P.D. Adds Children as Young as 11 to Facial Recognition Database

#22

Honestly, I have no problem with a database of public images showing/tracking people's public actions. It used to be in a small town you knew who was good and bad by their actions. With the population explosion, the only way we have a practical means to return to that is with facial recognition databases.

It used to be in a small town that your life was ruined by spurious rumors and salacious gossip.

Re: N.Y.P.D. Adds Children as Young as 11 to Facial Recognition Database

#23
post #18
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You may not. I don't want my government spying on me. What if I was gay and was seen leaving a gay club? Now what if I ended up in the Kingdom of Saud and that data was shared or leaked?

If you're gay, you should know the risks about going to Saudi Arabia or any place with similar laws and avoid going there. One does not usually "end up" in a different country unless they're kidnapped and at that point the homosexuality laws are really the least of your problems.

How do you avoid being born in a place like that?

Re: N.Y.P.D. Adds Children as Young as 11 to Facial Recognition Database

#24

I know that this might be an unpopular opinion, but if privacy really is dead, why don't we just make this data public? I know there's significant risks, but I feel like it's a better step forward than having this technology developed and deployed in secret.

why do you think privacy is dead? Where I travel, (digital and otherwise) privacy is quite alive and well. (This is definitely outside of highly populated first-world cities.)

Which way are things trending where you are today? The cost to surveil is going down at a tremendous rate so it is just a matter of time before someone decides to pay to surveil you and then sell their insights or take advantage of them. I don't think it's possible for politicians to keep up with the rate of tech advancement. Did you ever watch a congressional hearing in the US on any technology realated subject? It's a comedic bit.

Re: N.Y.P.D. Adds Children as Young as 11 to Facial Recognition Database

#25
Facial recognition helps catch criminals.

Young people can be criminals too. And if the police catch them while still juvenile, they might have more of a chance to turn their life around.

Young people can also go missing, and facial recognition of security cams could help find them.

I honestly can't see any reason why children shouldn't be included like everyone else.

It goes without saying that a conviction should never depend on computer matching, and that safeguards need to be in place to prevent abuse and limit to legitimate law-enforcement purposes.

But trying to locate suspects or victims in the first place? Children are no less important here than adults.

Re: N.Y.P.D. Adds Children as Young as 11 to Facial Recognition Database

#26

>The New York Police Department has been loading thousands of arrest photos of children and teenagers into a facial recognition database despite evidence the technology has a higher risk of false matches in younger faces. They already have the photos from arrest records. They already have footage from security cameras, etc. I don't see a problem in using computer algorithms to try to find possible matches between the…

Except DNA and Fingerprints are far less accurate than you’re led to believe [1]. Having worked with DNA, contamination is likely insanely probable and I doubt the validity of all cases it is used as the only piece of hard evidence (it’s alright circumstantial evidence).

The greater question has to do with what our rights are. The reality is, our system has been setup such that everyone commits crimes. By applying highly effective methods, you’re essentially enslaving the population. That’s why we had laws protecting freedom of speech and unreasonable search and seizure. The U.S. was setup to be particularly sensitive to those issues. The reason they are in the constitution is it was believed government would eventually try to chip away at the freedom and it did.

That’s why people are concerned. Their duty is to keep the peace. That does not necessarily mean or need to mean spying 24/7.

[1] http://darwin.bio.uci.edu/~mueller/pdf/forensic_dna_dec_p12-...

Re: N.Y.P.D. Adds Children as Young as 11 to Facial Recognition Database

#27

>The New York Police Department has been loading thousands of arrest photos of children and teenagers into a facial recognition database despite evidence the technology has a higher risk of false matches in younger faces. They already have the photos from arrest records. They already have footage from security cameras, etc. I don't see a problem in using computer algorithms to try to find possible matches between the…

Presumably the documented higher risk of false positives outweighs the "advantages" of catching a couple of kids doing what kids usually do.

Re: N.Y.P.D. Adds Children as Young as 11 to Facial Recognition Database

#28
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're gay, you should know the risks about going to Saudi Arabia or any place with similar laws and avoid going there. One does not usually "end up" in a different country unless they're kidnapped and at that point the homosexuality laws are really the least of your problems.

How do you avoid being born in a place like that?

If you're gay and were born in Saudi Arabia, and managed to get to a point where you're photographed leaving a gay club in NYC, then don't go back to Saudi Arabia.

Re: N.Y.P.D. Adds Children as Young as 11 to Facial Recognition Database

#29

>The New York Police Department has been loading thousands of arrest photos of children and teenagers into a facial recognition database despite evidence the technology has a higher risk of false matches in younger faces. They already have the photos from arrest records. They already have footage from security cameras, etc. I don't see a problem in using computer algorithms to try to find possible matches between the…

They are young and learning and deserve a chance to better themselves without being hassled by computers. Also, what chance has facial recognition to match a 11 year old kid three years later? It quickly becomes useless data, don't you agree?

Re: N.Y.P.D. Adds Children as Young as 11 to Facial Recognition Database

#30

> “We have these photos. It makes sense,” Chief Shea said in the interview. ah, yeah, outstanding argument - looking forward to seeing it applied to all other electronic data ever produced, no matter how old they are

We have these AR-15s and all dressed up in SWAT gear, why not start something where we get to use them. /s

Sometimes when you get all the equipment, it can encourage usage, just like military gear to police, or large databases gained from surveillance that make detective work way too easy.

I feel like law enforcement has relied on data from surveillance for so long that everyone has forgotten real detective work and there is just lots of data noise and toys they are using to up budgets, in the end it might be the end of us.

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