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Most internet service providers are gone – Sonic has survived and thrived

sfchronicle.com

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Re: Most internet service providers are gone – Sonic has survived and thrived

#31

Post by inetknght »

zalthor wrote: post #22

Maybe I'm being too picky? Or a maybe I'm just in the minority, bit I don't really like using Sonic. I mean, their internet works, and customer support is fine (but I've had as good a service from Comcast too). What I find annoying from Sonic is their billing process. I dislike that they foist a random router onto you and charge you $10 a month (and charge you if you want to return it). I also dislike that they force…

> I get that most advertising is not supposed to reflect reality

I'm not a lawyer but I'd strongly argue the other way around. Advertising something disconnected with reality is (or, should be) illegal. It's called False Advertising or Deceptive Advertising and it's unfortunately the status quo.

Re: Most internet service providers are gone – Sonic has survived and thrived

#32

Post by cbhl »

Avamander wrote: post #30
zalthor wrote: post #22

Maybe I'm being too picky? Or a maybe I'm just in the minority, bit I don't really like using Sonic. I mean, their internet works, and customer support is fine (but I've had as good a service from Comcast too). What I find annoying from Sonic is their billing process. I dislike that they foist a random router onto you and charge you $10 a month (and charge you if you want to return it). I also dislike that they force…

10$? Do you get a dedicated landline-line or is it actually just VoIP?

That depends on whether you get ADSL (6 Mbps per copper phone line, resold AT&T, but a real phone line) or Fiber Optic (gigabit fiber optic to the apartment, but you get an additional box that exposes a phone jack plugged into the ONT in the closet, so presumably VOIP).

I've seen Sonic hook up places in SF with both; they sell the ADSL to try and get the revenue to build out more Fiber.

The Sonic technician I spoke to at my last apartment said we could just leave the phone line unplugged if we didn't need it, but that setting it up was not optional for some bureaucratic reason. (Even made us pick a phone number from a list...)

Re: Most internet service providers are gone – Sonic has survived and thrived

#33

Post by floren »

fletchowns wrote: post #21
__sy__ wrote: post #4

Just wanted to chime in about how happy with their residential service in SF. I have their 1Gbps package. With Comcast, this would most often translate to a real-life asymetric 250mbps download, 50mbps upload speed. With Sonic: I'm consistently getting SYMMETRIC 900mbps+! It's insane and comes in real-handy when you're pushing a few gigs of file from your home server to AWS... Edit: I have cat6 ethernet wired through…

I would happily switch from Comcast but when I check availability for where I live in Livermore, they only offer 50Mbps. Currently paying ~180/mo for Comcast gigabit and TV (and phone that I don't use). I would fork over quite a bit for symmetrical gigabit, very jealous!

I used Sonic in Livermore because despite the relatively low speeds, I didn't have to reboot the modem every week like Comcast!

Re: Most internet service providers are gone – Sonic has survived and thrived

#34

Post by chaostheory »

zalthor wrote: post #22

Maybe I'm being too picky? Or a maybe I'm just in the minority, bit I don't really like using Sonic. I mean, their internet works, and customer support is fine (but I've had as good a service from Comcast too). What I find annoying from Sonic is their billing process. I dislike that they foist a random router onto you and charge you $10 a month (and charge you if you want to return it). I also dislike that they force…

> 1GBPS internet at $40 a month" and only a year later realize that you're paying $75 a month instead

I don’t feel you realize how good you have it. There are even more annoying hidden charges from Comcast, AT&T, and Verizon. Moreover, for only 400 mbps I pay $200 a month while you only pay $75 for fiber internet. To be clear my cost is only a temporary discount that will shoot up to nearly $400 in a few months. At which time I will be forced to downgrade

You’re being too picky given the state of the ISP duopoly market. I would gladly switch ISP providers with you if it were possible

Re: Most internet service providers are gone – Sonic has survived and thrived

#35

Post by Random_BSD_Geek »

zalthor wrote: post #22

Maybe I'm being too picky? Or a maybe I'm just in the minority, bit I don't really like using Sonic. I mean, their internet works, and customer support is fine (but I've had as good a service from Comcast too). What I find annoying from Sonic is their billing process. I dislike that they foist a random router onto you and charge you $10 a month (and charge you if you want to return it). I also dislike that they force…

It sounds like you're buying their DSL service. DSL is delivered over the telephone network's copper. A copper pair is necessary to deliver DSL.

In the 90s, legislation was passed that forced the ILECs to open up their copper networks to anyone. This allowed companies like Covad and Sonic to sell DSL over copper that was owned by the phone company, but the phone company got to charge for access. (I believe this legislation was recently reversed or modified in the phone companies' favor but don't know any details.)

So when you buy DSL you're buying both a few copper wires from the phone company and internet service from the guys on the other end of those wires.

As for who needs a landline... wires can be more reliable than radio waves under certain circumstances.

Re: Most internet service providers are gone – Sonic has survived and thrived

#36

Post by scurvy »

butterfi wrote: post #18

I have Sonic at home, despite that it is basically AT&T dual bonded DSL and slower then my old Comcast connection. Its fast enough and I really like Sonic. Comcast, not so much.

What's the reason to not like Comcast? For me it was Sonic at $90/mo for 3 maybe 4mbps (not a lie), or Comcast at $80 for 300mbps. It's a no-brainer there.

I'm not doing anything illegal so I don't care about Comcast cracking down on torrents. The data caps are high enough that I can't hit them in my max-2 simultaneous Netflix streams. Comcast let me buy my own modem instead of using theirs. The only time I lost Comcast service was when all of San Francisco lost power.

Comcast is pretty bad/predatory as a cable TV operator. But we're talking about Internet service, and they're pretty straightforward there.

If you're in SF, can't get Sonic fiber, and really hate Comcast, then you should look into Monkeybrains.

Re: Most internet service providers are gone – Sonic has survived and thrived

#38

Post by robbiet480 »

I tried to get Sonic at 100 Grand Avenue in Oakland after they put fliers on homes and businesses all around saying "We are coming to Oakland with our own fiber and offering gigabit!" (they have been in Oakland for a long time with their AT&T DSL product). Turns out, they decided to not install to my building (254 unit high-rise), most likely due to a, what I believe to be, illegal exclusive line ownership agreement that my commercial landlords signed with AT&T.

Thankfully, a recent entrant to the inner Bay Area market, Wave G (which has roots in Astound, a name those of you with connection to Walnut Creek might recognize, and RCN) is now providing me symmetric gigabit point to point internet for $80/month with no caps. Just very glad to finally be rid of Comcast.

I will say though that I've previously gotten Sonic at business addresses, both DSL and Fiber, and they have been super great. Glad to see the small guy winning in such a competitive market as the Bay Area.

Re: Most internet service providers are gone – Sonic has survived and thrived

#39

Post by inferiorhuman »

Random_BSD_Geek wrote: post #35
zalthor wrote: post #22

Maybe I'm being too picky? Or a maybe I'm just in the minority, bit I don't really like using Sonic. I mean, their internet works, and customer support is fine (but I've had as good a service from Comcast too). What I find annoying from Sonic is their billing process. I dislike that they foist a random router onto you and charge you $10 a month (and charge you if you want to return it). I also dislike that they force…

It sounds like you're buying their DSL service. DSL is delivered over the telephone network's copper. A copper pair is necessary to deliver DSL. In the 90s, legislation was passed that forced the ILECs to open up their copper networks to anyone. This allowed companies like Covad and Sonic to sell DSL over copper that was owned by the phone company, but the phone company got to charge for access. (I believe this legis…

It sounds like you're buying their DSL service. DSL is delivered over the telephone network's copper. A copper pair is necessary to deliver DSL.

Nope. Before they rolled out the fiber product you could BYOD. Of course before Fusion they would sell you service without a contract and then expect you to call them every time they raised the prices.

With the current Fusion offerings (ADSL, VDSL, AT&T FTTN, FTTH) they promise it's a $40/mo rate, but then omit that they charge $10/mo for the modem rental. You CAN opt out of the modem rental but then the monthly rate goes up to $50/mo. There's no option to purchase the modem outright (and it a junky Pace unit).

At least that's how things were when they first rolled out fiber. There was a ton of confusion and the phone reps dished out information contradicting the support reps who post in the Sonic support forum. Things may have changed since then but I doubt it as Sonic seemed extraordinarily attached to their subpar modem/router things. I ended up paying $10/mo for a defective modem I never used because it was easier than dealing with support.

Oh, and let's say you're a long-time Sonic customer that wanted to upgrade to fiber. Want the $40/mo promo rate? HA! Good luck. Sonic has shifted towards giving the finger to loyal customers in favor of spending beaucoup bucks on new ones. For a while they were even offering ~6 months free if you got a coupon code from Nextdoor (UGH).

Re: Most internet service providers are gone – Sonic has survived and thrived

#40

Post by TD-Linux »

Random_BSD_Geek wrote: post #35
zalthor wrote: post #22

Maybe I'm being too picky? Or a maybe I'm just in the minority, bit I don't really like using Sonic. I mean, their internet works, and customer support is fine (but I've had as good a service from Comcast too). What I find annoying from Sonic is their billing process. I dislike that they foist a random router onto you and charge you $10 a month (and charge you if you want to return it). I also dislike that they force…

It sounds like you're buying their DSL service. DSL is delivered over the telephone network's copper. A copper pair is necessary to deliver DSL. In the 90s, legislation was passed that forced the ILECs to open up their copper networks to anyone. This allowed companies like Covad and Sonic to sell DSL over copper that was owned by the phone company, but the phone company got to charge for access. (I believe this legis…

I think the mandatory phone service if you get Sonic FTTN (aka resold AT&T FTTN) is also a result of that regulation. DSL is Title 1 but phone is Title 2, or something like that.
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