In Brazil, Amazon Protections Are Slashed and Forests Fall • Hacker News Board

Re: In Brazil, Amazon Protections Are Slashed and Forests Fall

#11

Post by addicted » Sun, Jul 28, 2019, 1:22 PM UTC

hrdwdmrbl wrote: post #6

andrenth wrote: post #5

The other day there was a thread on HN where most people agreed that Amazon should pay France more taxes because even though it’s an internet business, it benefits from things done by the French government. Maybe developed countries should start paying a tax to Brazil and other Amazon forest countries so that they can preserve it. After all, most didn’t do a good job preserving their own forests, so demanding underde…

This ^^! Most people do not appreciate what truly being poor is like. If the choice is development or preserving the rainforest, Brazilians deserve the right to choose for themselves

Except destroying the rain forests is gonna do absolutely nothing to help the Brazilian poor.

So I’m not sure what being truly poor has anything to do with this. This will be almost entirely about displacing the poor, poisoning their water, and rewarding corrupt cronies.

Re: In Brazil, Amazon Protections Are Slashed and Forests Fall

#12

Post by zelphirkalt » Sun, Jul 28, 2019, 1:23 PM UTC

andrenth wrote: post #5

The other day there was a thread on HN where most people agreed that Amazon should pay France more taxes because even though it’s an internet business, it benefits from things done by the French government. Maybe developed countries should start paying a tax to Brazil and other Amazon forest countries so that they can preserve it. After all, most didn’t do a good job preserving their own forests, so demanding underde…

In principle a nice idea, as we all depend on that forest, however, people like that would abuse this and extort other countries and demand more and more.

Bolsonaro is also simply wrong to claim that it is their forest, only because it is on Brazil ground. The whole world depends on it, so it must be a resource shared and kept up by all. Bolsonaro and people like him are holding such things like rain forest hostage. Please send in the military or something to wrestle control over such a valuable thing from that insane person. We can not afford to be extorted by the likes of him on a global scale, when time draws near, where the future of the whole species will be decided.

Re: In Brazil, Amazon Protections Are Slashed and Forests Fall

#13

Post by nfrbc » Sun, Jul 28, 2019, 1:24 PM UTC

hrdwdmrbl wrote: post #6

andrenth wrote: post #5

The other day there was a thread on HN where most people agreed that Amazon should pay France more taxes because even though it’s an internet business, it benefits from things done by the French government. Maybe developed countries should start paying a tax to Brazil and other Amazon forest countries so that they can preserve it. After all, most didn’t do a good job preserving their own forests, so demanding underde…

This ^^! Most people do not appreciate what truly being poor is like. If the choice is development or preserving the rainforest, Brazilians deserve the right to choose for themselves

> choice is development or preserving the rainforest

That's a false dilemma, though. There is nothing preventing us Brazilians from choosing both things, apart from wacko politicians.

Re: In Brazil, Amazon Protections Are Slashed and Forests Fall

#14

Post by zelphirkalt » Sun, Jul 28, 2019, 1:24 PM UTC

hrdwdmrbl wrote: post #6

andrenth wrote: post #5

The other day there was a thread on HN where most people agreed that Amazon should pay France more taxes because even though it’s an internet business, it benefits from things done by the French government. Maybe developed countries should start paying a tax to Brazil and other Amazon forest countries so that they can preserve it. After all, most didn’t do a good job preserving their own forests, so demanding underde…

This ^^! Most people do not appreciate what truly being poor is like. If the choice is development or preserving the rainforest, Brazilians deserve the right to choose for themselves

Decide for themselves to destroy/change world climate even more? I do not think so. It is their responsibility to keep the rain forests in good shape. I agree though, that they should get help from all over the world.

Re: In Brazil, Amazon Protections Are Slashed and Forests Fall

#15

Post by nfrbc » Sun, Jul 28, 2019, 1:27 PM UTC

zelphirkalt wrote: post #12

andrenth wrote: post #5

The other day there was a thread on HN where most people agreed that Amazon should pay France more taxes because even though it’s an internet business, it benefits from things done by the French government. Maybe developed countries should start paying a tax to Brazil and other Amazon forest countries so that they can preserve it. After all, most didn’t do a good job preserving their own forests, so demanding underde…

In principle a nice idea, as we all depend on that forest, however, people like that would abuse this and extort other countries and demand more and more. Bolsonaro is also simply wrong to claim that it is their forest, only because it is on Brazil ground. The whole world depends on it, so it must be a resource shared and kept up by all. Bolsonaro and people like him are holding such things like rain forest hostage.…

I agree with everything you said.

Bolsonaro is not claiming the forest for Brazilians. He's claiming it for his party and his allies, and for criminals that have been taking advantage of that.

The poor from Brazil don't stand to get anything at all out of this.

Re: In Brazil, Amazon Protections Are Slashed and Forests Fall

#16

Post by mercurial » Sun, Jul 28, 2019, 1:27 PM UTC

hrdwdmrbl wrote: post #6

andrenth wrote: post #5

The other day there was a thread on HN where most people agreed that Amazon should pay France more taxes because even though it’s an internet business, it benefits from things done by the French government. Maybe developed countries should start paying a tax to Brazil and other Amazon forest countries so that they can preserve it. After all, most didn’t do a good job preserving their own forests, so demanding underde…

This ^^! Most people do not appreciate what truly being poor is like. If the choice is development or preserving the rainforest, Brazilians deserve the right to choose for themselves

Apparently, the native tribes don't get the right to choose.

Re: In Brazil, Amazon Protections Are Slashed and Forests Fall

#17

Post by andrenth » Sun, Jul 28, 2019, 1:27 PM UTC

dnewms wrote: post #7

andrenth wrote: post #5

The other day there was a thread on HN where most people agreed that Amazon should pay France more taxes because even though it’s an internet business, it benefits from things done by the French government. Maybe developed countries should start paying a tax to Brazil and other Amazon forest countries so that they can preserve it. After all, most didn’t do a good job preserving their own forests, so demanding underde…

At least Norway does: "Norway makes annual payments to Brazil as part of a long-term billion-dollar program to curb the loss of Amazon rainforest to slow global warming." https://www.reuters.com/article/us-norway-brazil-amazon-idUS...

Why doesn’t Norway stop making use of all that fossil fuel they sit on?

Re: In Brazil, Amazon Protections Are Slashed and Forests Fall

#18

Post by zelphirkalt » Sun, Jul 28, 2019, 1:27 PM UTC

This happens when other nations and unions stand by idly instead of immediately threaten sanctions against insane people like Bolsonaro. There needs to be so much pressure on the country, that they riot against people like him and rid themselves of people like him. The moment this guy talked about cutting down trees, other nations should have immediately threatened with heavy sanctions, to stop this thread right away.

Re: In Brazil, Amazon Protections Are Slashed and Forests Fall

#19

Post by forinti » Sun, Jul 28, 2019, 1:28 PM UTC

Brazil's southeast (which includes São Paulo - the most industrialised state and with 40 million people) gets humidity from the Amazon. They have had water shortages these last few years.

This government has given power to the greediest and most short-sighted elements of Brazilian society. They have always played a big role, but they now run unbridled and unashamed.

Re: In Brazil, Amazon Protections Are Slashed and Forests Fall

#20

Post by nfrbc » Sun, Jul 28, 2019, 1:29 PM UTC

addicted wrote: post #11

hrdwdmrbl wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This ^^! Most people do not appreciate what truly being poor is like. If the choice is development or preserving the rainforest, Brazilians deserve the right to choose for themselves

Except destroying the rain forests is gonna do absolutely nothing to help the Brazilian poor. So I’m not sure what being truly poor has anything to do with this. This will be almost entirely about displacing the poor, poisoning their water, and rewarding corrupt cronies.

Indeed. It's probably going to be even worse for the poor in the affected area from now on.

Illegal wood extraction doesn't only kill trees. Those criminals have historically killed citizens in order to prevent being caught.