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The Library Card Project: The Ease of Forming Anonymous Companies in the U.S.

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Re: The Library Card Project: The Ease of Forming Anonymous Companies in the U.S.

#31

Post by dfeojm-zlib »

Here's an example of what you need for a Delaware C-corp:

https://www.incnow.com/delaware-corporation/

- Name of the corporation

- Name and address of the Registered Agent of the corporation (usually a mail forwarding service)

- Statement of the type of business that the corporation will engage in

- Number of shares of authorized stock that the corporation will issue

- Par value of each share

- Name and signature of the incorporator

- Indemnification clause for breaches of Duty of Care

- Allowance for Director Amended Bylaws

----------------------------

Library card, i.e., Mountain View, California:

https://library.mountainview.gov/selfreg

- (photo identification)

- (address verification)

- Last Name: *

- First Name:*

- Middle Name:

- Street Address:*

- City, State, & Zip:*

- Phone number:* (XXX-XXX-XXXX)

- Birthdate:* (MM-DD-YYYY)

- Email address:

* Required

----------------------------

Required by: Sections 214-216 PATRIOT Act of 2001

http://www.ala.org/advocacy/advleg/federallegislation/theusa...

https://www.congress.gov/bill/107th-congress/house-bill/0316...

Re: The Library Card Project: The Ease of Forming Anonymous Companies in the U.S.

#32

Post by nostromo »

Operyl wrote: post #26
sneak wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about purchasing a firearm?

How was that relevant to the conversation?

He's pointing out that if one believes you should be able to vote without ID because it's a civil right, then you should also be able to buy a gun without ID because it's a civil right.

My guess is that he or she is saying that it's reasonable in both cases to require ID.

Re: The Library Card Project: The Ease of Forming Anonymous Companies in the U.S.

#33

Post by jakelazaroff »

souprock wrote: post #20
teachrdan wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To the contrary: There were only four known cases of voter fraud in the 2016 elections[0]; more stringent voting requirements suppresses voting, especially by poor, black and/or Latinx voters.[1] It certainly seems the case that more damage has been done to society via corporations to which no human person can be associated than by voter fraud. [0] https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/12/01/0-... [1] h…

It's pretty circular reasoning to argue against methods for detecting voter fraud on the basis that we haven't detected voter fraud. If there is voter fraud, it might go away if we got reliable detection. Fraud is less likely when being caught is certain, and it is far more likely when being caught is about as likely as getting hit by lightening. Even if there isn't voter fraud, the mere fact that people are worried…

GP isn't arguing against detecting voter fraud. They're arguing against making the registration process harder in order to prevent (basically nonexistent) voter fraud.

The reason people in the U.S. are worried about voter fraud is that one side of the political spectrum is pushing the narrative — without any real evidence — that voter fraud is rampant. We shouldn't make it more difficult to vote in order to fix a made-up problem.

Re: The Library Card Project: The Ease of Forming Anonymous Companies in the U.S.

#34

Post by JumpCrisscross »

rwbt wrote: post #19

Sure you don't need much 'info' to create a corporation. But if said corporation has any income/employees the reporting and maintenance requirements are far greater than maintaining a library card.

> if said corporation has any income/employees

Income, opens a bank account, takes out a loan, et cetera. Incorporation per se has no need to be intensive.

Re: The Library Card Project: The Ease of Forming Anonymous Companies in the U.S.

#35

Post by zdragnar »

reaperducer wrote: post #14
jdoliner wrote: post #4

I don't see any particular reason why the identification process for a corporation should be more stringent than a library card. What is astonishing to me is that both are meaningfully more stringent than voting. In Minnesota for example, all one needs is another registered voter to vouch for them. https://www.sos.state.mn.us/elections-voting/register-to-vot...

In Minnesota for example, all one needs is another registered voter to vouch for them. My thoughts on this are old school. Like 1700's old school. A person's right to vote exists with or without documentation. A piece of paper, an entry in a ledger, or a row in a database has no bearing on whether that right exists, or should be exercised. In many of the states where I've lived (13 so far), all that was needed to vot…

> A person's right to vote exists with or without documentation.

All rights exist independent on the government, because the government doea not grant rights.

The government infringes on rights for the purpose of governing, and the limits to what it is allowed are the US constitution.

None of that means that there isn't a legitimate interest, of the government and public at large, in ensuring that elections are conducted fairly.

Re: The Library Card Project: The Ease of Forming Anonymous Companies in the U.S.

#36

Post by jdoliner »

reaperducer wrote: post #14
jdoliner wrote: post #4

I don't see any particular reason why the identification process for a corporation should be more stringent than a library card. What is astonishing to me is that both are meaningfully more stringent than voting. In Minnesota for example, all one needs is another registered voter to vouch for them. https://www.sos.state.mn.us/elections-voting/register-to-vot...

In Minnesota for example, all one needs is another registered voter to vouch for them. My thoughts on this are old school. Like 1700's old school. A person's right to vote exists with or without documentation. A piece of paper, an entry in a ledger, or a row in a database has no bearing on whether that right exists, or should be exercised. In many of the states where I've lived (13 so far), all that was needed to vot…

Do you think voting should be limited to citizens of the country? Or that each person should only get 1 vote? If so that seems impossible to implement without requiring identification, if not that seems tantamount to infringing on people's right to vote, if someone can vote twice against me while I only get 1 vote because I'm following the rules then that means my vote effectively wasn't counted.

Re: The Library Card Project: The Ease of Forming Anonymous Companies in the U.S.

#37

Post by SiempreViernes »

eatbitseveryday wrote: post #28
reaperducer wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Minnesota for example, all one needs is another registered voter to vouch for them. My thoughts on this are old school. Like 1700's old school. A person's right to vote exists with or without documentation. A piece of paper, an entry in a ledger, or a row in a database has no bearing on whether that right exists, or should be exercised. In many of the states where I've lived (13 so far), all that was needed to vot…

> My thoughts on this are old school. Like 1700's old school. A person's right to vote exists with or without documentation. A piece of paper, an entry in a ledger, or a row in a database has no bearing on whether that right exists, or should be exercised. How do we ensure non-citizens aren’t voting? We accept many visitors - refugees, H1B, tourists, F1/I-20, etc. None are granted voting rights.

They clearly said that was someone else’s problem, to be handled at some later point in the processing where options for deciding the question are more limited.

Re: The Library Card Project: The Ease of Forming Anonymous Companies in the U.S.

#38

Post by mikestew »

Operyl wrote: post #26
sneak wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about purchasing a firearm?

How was that relevant to the conversation?

How much identification is needed to exercise one “constitutional right” versus another? Should there be a difference? Though one might legitimately take the question to be flame-baity, I think it’s a valid question in light of the original statement.

Re: The Library Card Project: The Ease of Forming Anonymous Companies in the U.S.

#39

Post by pdpi »

Operyl wrote: post #26
sneak wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about purchasing a firearm?

How was that relevant to the conversation?

It serves as an argument as to what sort of requirements might be reasonable to ask for in order to exercise a constitutional right.

If asking for ID to buy a gun is reasonable, then the argument of whether it’s reasonable to ask for ID to vote can’t be one of principle, but has to be one of degree.

Re: The Library Card Project: The Ease of Forming Anonymous Companies in the U.S.

#40

Post by dredmorbius »

souprock wrote: post #20
teachrdan wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To the contrary: There were only four known cases of voter fraud in the 2016 elections[0]; more stringent voting requirements suppresses voting, especially by poor, black and/or Latinx voters.[1] It certainly seems the case that more damage has been done to society via corporations to which no human person can be associated than by voter fraud. [0] https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/12/01/0-... [1] h…

It's pretty circular reasoning to argue against methods for detecting voter fraud on the basis that we haven't detected voter fraud. If there is voter fraud, it might go away if we got reliable detection. Fraud is less likely when being caught is certain, and it is far more likely when being caught is about as likely as getting hit by lightening. Even if there isn't voter fraud, the mere fact that people are worried…

It's that effective voter manipulation is vastly more effectively accomplished by means *other8 than bussing tens of thousands of bodies (or corpses) to polling booths.

Depress voter turnout, run third-party, identity-appealing, or confusingly-similarly named candidates. Print confusing ballots. Run complex initiatives or propositions with little or no discussion. Leverage majorities in one domain (Senate, statehouses, governor's mansions) to achieve, retain, or negate majorities or minorities elsewhere (vacancies are often filled by gubernatorial or state legislature votes, redistricting is often controlled by statehouse majority, a GoP Senate nullifies much of the power of a Dem House). Have a highly partisan secretary of state certifying statewide elections, including for national office. Have a Supreme Court structure based on few judges, narrow and long-lived partisan majorities, full-bank hearings, and obstructed nominations. Non-trasnsparent, un-auditablre, readily-hacked, and highly partisan technical voting systems. Grossly manipulated media.

Individual voter fraud simply isn't where it's at.

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