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In the US, wells being drilled ever deeper as groundwater vanishes

arstechnica.com

111–120 of 185 posts

Re: In the US, wells being drilled ever deeper as groundwater vanishes

#111
post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Interestingly, farmers view water usage as a trade secret I wonder why. Do slight changes in irrigation patterns have a significant effect on crops?

Definitely! If someone is able to figure out how to use less water to grow the same amount of crops they could totally outcompete and undercut other producers. There's an interesting Planet Money episode about it: https://www.npr.org/2019/06/12/732147345/the-water-marketpla...

>If someone is able to figure out how to use less water to grow the same amount of crops

We've already had that for years. Farmers don't want to make the structural investments required to get there. Water for farming needs to become prohibitively expensive for them to even consider moving away from their wasteful large fields. Tax the hell out of the land, too.

What takes an acre of land and 100,000 gallons of water (a crop of wheat grass) can be done in a building 1/8 of an acre, 90% lower water requirements if not more, and produce 6x more than what the open plot of land does, on a yearly basis, on average.

I did and proved that almost a decade ago. Looks like nobody still wants to listen.

Re: In the US, wells being drilled ever deeper as groundwater vanishes

#112
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you own a lawn? Scotland is perhaps the only place I know where you can not water lawn in summer.

I grew up in Ohio and currently live in western PA. I've never once watered my yard.

I envy you guys all. It takes me up to 2 hours in the evening and I am not happy with the results.

Re: In the US, wells being drilled ever deeper as groundwater vanishes

#113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are so many water researchers opposed to letting the price of water vary and drive market-based conservation?

Presumably because they do not want huge segments of the human population to die because they are unable to afford access to the literally most basic necessity for life on this planet.

Food costs money; why should food and water be managed differently? (Presumably, with subsidies or such as needed)

Re: In the US, wells being drilled ever deeper as groundwater vanishes

#114

If this were actually a serious issue, we would be discussing NAWPA again for real. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_Water_and_Power... The original blueprint used nukes to dig the trenches, but conventional explosives work just fine.

> If this were actually a serious issue, we would I fail to see how the choice of response (or not) determines seriousness of the issue. We've seen plenty of people stick their head in the sand in the past.

It also sounds like a false dichotomy.

Re: In the US, wells being drilled ever deeper as groundwater vanishes

#115
post #18

Lets stop wastefully watering lawns as a starting point. Some places are probably already doing that, but the use of native landscaping needs to spread further.

The largest water user, at least in California, is agriculture. Fortunately they're now planting fewer acres of low-value crops such as cotton. But other crops use an insane amount: 1 walnut 4.9 gallons 1 almond 1.1 gallons 1 pistachio 0.75 gallons And it looks like Palm Springs is a big water user. Must be all those golf courses? https://www.motherjones.com/environment/2014/02/wheres-calif...

Dates not mentioned? Date palms can drink cube a day!

Re: In the US, wells being drilled ever deeper as groundwater vanishes

#117
post #88
post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. My father in law lives in a town that has no water metering (and usually, but not always, plenty of water). In the summer he puts his sprinklers in 2 or 3 times a day, even when dire warnings are issued about water consumption. Human behavior is all about the impact on the back pocket (particularly if you are a pensioner).

Where does he live? Serious question. I'd be interested in whether or not his behavior is a function of living in an area drowning in fresh water sources? If he does not live in such an area, then I'm really interested in how the municipality is able to keep the price of water that low? That would seem to defy the rule of supply and demand in my mind.

Most places in the Northeast have an abundance of water, and water rates mostly fund infrastructure. For example, NYC only began metering water usage in 1986.

Re: In the US, wells being drilled ever deeper as groundwater vanishes

#118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not just price water to reflect supply realities? Why would anyone care about saving water when it's so dirt cheap? "Awareness" seems like a waste of time in comparison.

Because we as a society have decided that we are all better off if it's cheap enough that poor people can still use it on a whim. Of course this results in some people over-using but we think that's less of a problem.

Artificial suppression of water prices is equivalent to a direct cash transfer proportional to water usage. The more water you waste, the more money you get.

The exact same thing (making the poor able to afford water) could be accomplished much less destructively by making the cash transfer a flat constant (thereby not incentivizing gratuitous water wastage).

Re: In the US, wells being drilled ever deeper as groundwater vanishes

#119
post #45

A local groundwater management agency in Ventura County, CA recently started a pilot program that established a groundwater market among farmers in the county. Following the early 2010s drought in California, laws were enacted to cap and eventually reduce the amount of groundwater that can be extracted. Recent advancements in water usage tracking infrastructure, combined with the law has led to a natural environment…

What does it use _“block-chain”_ for?

hype

Re: In the US, wells being drilled ever deeper as groundwater vanishes

#120
post #45

A local groundwater management agency in Ventura County, CA recently started a pilot program that established a groundwater market among farmers in the county. Following the early 2010s drought in California, laws were enacted to cap and eventually reduce the amount of groundwater that can be extracted. Recent advancements in water usage tracking infrastructure, combined with the law has led to a natural environment…

What does it use _“block-chain”_ for?

Anonymity, presumably. That said, you'd think there would be no reason that whatever real-world authority is ensuring no one extracts more than their purchased credits allow would already have all the secret information and could just be the clearing house for the transactions.
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