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No CS Degree – Interviews with self-taught developers

nocsdegree.com

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Re: No CS Degree – Interviews with self-taught developers

#421

Post by souprock »

zepolen wrote: post #414
harianus wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like you’re saying it’s nice to know the layers of abstraction but it sounds like you don’t use it in real life. As a non CS degree developer I can’t really see anything that I’m missing because of not having the degree. I have a successful business, get hired for freelance jobs for a good salary, can build anything I want, ... Would love to know what one would get out of having the degree versus self study.

An engineer with a degree and a contractor can both build you a bridge. The difference is one will remain standing after an earthquake.

Engineers with degrees work for the contractors. They minimize materials and cost. The result doesn't always remain standing, even without an earthquake:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_International_Universi...

Building good bridges without an engineering degree is easy. You simply don't minimize materials and cost.

Re: No CS Degree – Interviews with self-taught developers

#422

Post by flor1s »

In my opinion,

1. You can be highly educated in a subject without getting a formal degree.

2. A CS degree is not a programmer/developer degree. CS is to programming as art is to drawing.

3. Having knowledge of CS might mean you can more easier adopt to a variety of roles (front-end, back-end, systems programming) but comes at a cost that you probably have less practical skills than someone who is specialized in this (because of self-education/going to a trade school/learning on the job).

I have a bachelor in informatics, master in CS and PhD in informatics (technically informatics is not CS, but there's a lot of overlap), but I would say I gained most programming/development knowledge through internships and working on personal projects.

Re: No CS Degree – Interviews with self-taught developers

#423

Post by willhslade »

ColanR wrote: post #318
thanatropism wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Effectively a "hard" degree is an IQ test. General cognitive skills exist and they're especially useful in software development. ITT people are focusing too hard on the content of a CS program and too little on the more general goals of an undergraduate degree: - expose you to multiple fields of knowledge while focusing on a main thread - help you develop generic thinking skills that should translate to a variety of…

> signalling to the world that you have the chops and the work ethic to go through with a major project with many frustrating stepping stone i.e., hazing.

Or, less dismissively, commitment.

Re: No CS Degree – Interviews with self-taught developers

#424

Post by fao_ »

kqr wrote: post #268
fao_ wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I started programming properly in 2010 when I was 12 or 13. Before that I did some small things in Inform 7, and now I remember it, Visual Basic, but I don't really consider that 'proper programming' as it was mostly cutting and pasting code with little understanding. I started with Inform 7, Python, and a little bit of Processing and Lua. I did three or four ludum dares and at some point I made most of a game in Lua…

> I agree with you about the quality of books. A fair chunk of the books on my bookshelf from that era are 80s/90s to early 00s because those books are just an order of magnitude better written, with a high signal to noise ratio. This is a common misconception. There were plenty of shit books then, too, you just won't find people remembering and recommending them. Whereas we haven't, collectively, discarded the shit…

I don't think that's quite the case. I think there are more books in the 2000s written about basically nothing. Look at the "For Dummies" series of books. They're accessible but the content they teach could be condensed into one or two blog posts with nothing lost except the material is easier to read in a single sitting and much easier to reference.

Re: No CS Degree – Interviews with self-taught developers

#425

Post by arvinsim »

lowercased wrote: post #354
module0000 wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Don't forget that you've probably also studied holy wars in considerable depth, too. This prepared him/her to understand the great conflict of vim and emacs users no doubt.

tabs v spaces may be an even greater conflict.

And on a lesser note, The Cult of Vi vs The Church of Emacs

Re: No CS Degree – Interviews with self-taught developers

#426

Post by icedchai »

jki275 wrote: post #348
naravara wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or the government. All you need to do is: a.) Be able to pass a drug test b.) Not have any problematic debts or associations with problematic groups (e.g. Aryan Nation, ISIS) c.) Have a certification or degree that is related to the very specific thing they are asking for. It's entirely clearing a checklist when they're recruiting. They have no idea how to evaluate for actual competence.

That's heavily dependent on where you are in government. It's not true any of the places I've worked.

Sounds like he’s talking about defense contractors. Many contracting firms just need “butts in seats” that they can bill out. Mediocre developers are better in some regards there: they bill out more hours since they’re slower, don’t mind 10+ year obsolete tech, and they don’t complain as much, which could endanger relations with the bureaucracy (customer.)

Re: No CS Degree – Interviews with self-taught developers

#428

Post by mycall »

evo_9 wrote: post #417
methodover wrote: post #277

I have a religious studies degree. I wonder if it’s prepared me better than a CS degree for the actual work I do. What did I learn with my RELS degree? Hermeneutics— understanding ancient texts written by lots of different authors in their original historical contexts, often which has been deeply redacted over time. Anyone who’s worked on any production code can see the benefit of being trained in that kind of thinki…

Funny, I'm similar. I have an English Degree (Fiction Writing emphasis) and minored in Religious studies. It's proven to be a positive in so many ways, mostly because I am an excellent communicator and able to explain complex subjects to non-tech folk. I've also been told that I stand out as totally different from every candidate they've interviewed, prior. I started programming on my own at age 11 and have been pass…

What is your opinion of Inform 7?

Re: No CS Degree – Interviews with self-taught developers

#429

Post by kazinator »

methodover wrote: post #277

I have a religious studies degree. I wonder if it’s prepared me better than a CS degree for the actual work I do. What did I learn with my RELS degree? Hermeneutics— understanding ancient texts written by lots of different authors in their original historical contexts, often which has been deeply redacted over time. Anyone who’s worked on any production code can see the benefit of being trained in that kind of thinki…

Well, Paul Graham did write in "Beating The Averages" that programming languages are "half technology, half religion".

Re: No CS Degree – Interviews with self-taught developers

#430

Post by L_226 »

lowercased wrote: post #354
module0000 wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Don't forget that you've probably also studied holy wars in considerable depth, too. This prepared him/her to understand the great conflict of vim and emacs users no doubt.

tabs v spaces may be an even greater conflict.

Here is a pretty good explanation of why tabs are superior: https://www.reddit.com/r/javascript/comments/c8drjo/nobody_t...
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