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Never-Googlers: Web users take the ultimate step to guard their data

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Re: Never-Googlers: Web users take the ultimate step to guard their data

#61

Post by lonelappde »

skybrian wrote: post #43
joosters wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Surely your phone is still repeatedly in touch with Google servers because you've got all that Google software on there. Just because you haven't signed in with a google account doesn't mean Google don't know who you are.

It doesn't mean they know who you are, either. That depends on what data is transmitted, what is stored, who has access to it, and what it means philosophically to know who someone is. There is not enough information to say. If there is tracking data associated with a phone but it's not associated with your real name, in what sense can you say they know you? There is a risk someone (who?) can connect it with other da…

If the police come to arrest Mr Anonymous because my phone activity matches something of interest, they will learn who I am when they knock down my door.

My phone has a cellular account with my name attached to it.

Re: Never-Googlers: Web users take the ultimate step to guard their data

#62

Post by SamWhited »

I did this a few years ago and the blog post (to my suprise) got covered on Ars Technica and others. It always amazes me how people respond with disbelief or with wonder and awe as if it's some difficult or hard to do thing. At the time there were good, if not better, alternatives for almost everything. The only thing I stuck with was Gmail and Google calendar, but since then I've discovered Fastmail which I think is far better at both (I highly recommend them, they're fairly inexpensive and that means you're not the product, you're the customer). Although for me it was less about privacy (at the time) and more about the fact that I had become dependent on the inter-connections between Google services so when they killed one (ie. Reader) it has a much bigger impact on my personal life than it should have. Now any time a product dies it's easy to move my data over to something else and I never get reliant on interoperability between branded services.

I've also got Google Analytics black holed in Firefox, and run an ad blocker of course which (I hope) catches most of their trackers; this just seems good for anyone to do though, even if they're not giving up Google's other services.

Re: Never-Googlers: Web users take the ultimate step to guard their data

#63

Post by yters »

At this point with the proliferation of cameras and listening devices, the only way to stay off Google's servers is to live in the backwoods, or in an undeveloped country, or live on a boat.

Kinda creepy, actually, when I say it like that. If Google is just a front for NSA then I'd say Big Brother is complete.

Re: Never-Googlers: Web users take the ultimate step to guard their data

#64

Post by wutbrodo »

ska wrote: post #20
phmagic wrote: post #4

(disclaimer: I work at a big tech firm, but I've had this opinion before working here) I'm confused by the lengths people have gone through to "protect" themselves from internet giants while freely giving away their info to credit card companies, traditional retailers, small businesses. Credit card transaction data have been sold for years without most of us knowing about it. Small startups, boutique stores rarely ha…

I don't think I have knowingly met anyone who took significant steps to limit exposure to big tech firms who hasn't also taken significant steps in other areas of their life. And people I have met who do take this stuff seriously do things like cash-only, PO box only, no (nearly) online accounts etc. They are certainly making their lives less convenient on this principal. Where are you meeting people who fit the desc…

For another anecdotal example, I have only met the exact opposite: people who take steps to avoid big tech tracking but happily use credit cards etc

Re: Never-Googlers: Web users take the ultimate step to guard their data

#65

Post by skybrian »

lonelappde wrote: post #61
skybrian wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't mean they know who you are, either. That depends on what data is transmitted, what is stored, who has access to it, and what it means philosophically to know who someone is. There is not enough information to say. If there is tracking data associated with a phone but it's not associated with your real name, in what sense can you say they know you? There is a risk someone (who?) can connect it with other da…

If the police come to arrest Mr Anonymous because my phone activity matches something of interest, they will learn who I am when they knock down my door. My phone has a cellular account with my name attached to it.

Well, at least you have a fairly specific threat model. But opsec for avoiding discovery by the police seems pretty hard?

Re: Never-Googlers: Web users take the ultimate step to guard their data

#66

Post by d1zzy »

pessimizer wrote: post #54
d1zzy wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No but there's a good argument there in terms of priorities. What is more likely to impact you negatively: Google building an internal profile based on your information and targeting ads based on it or your card information being stolen from insecure smaller vendors? Obviously those 2 choices are picked arbitrarily but they may explain why the OP chose to prefer the former over the latter. I would think every time we…

Google is worse without question. Having your card number stolen is a minor inconvenience whose danger is inflated by services offering to protect you from it. Happened to me once, they charged $1500 before my credit union called me. I had to spend a total of an hour on the phone with a few different people, and the money was credited back to my account within 48 hours. This is with a debit card , which are constantl…

Note that you provided reasons as to why having debit/credit card information stolen isn't such a big deal, if you get protection from fraudulent transactions, but haven't provided any reasons as to why Google targeting ads based on some profile they built on you is worse than that.

Re: Never-Googlers: Web users take the ultimate step to guard their data

#67

Post by jamespo »

SmellyGeekBoy wrote: post #59
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why the best choice is just to recommend your family get an iPhone. The default/least resistant path is far more private.

Apple are harvesting just as much data, they're just being less evil with it... For now.

nope

Re: Never-Googlers: Web users take the ultimate step to guard their data

#68

Post by filoleg »

elcomet wrote: post #53
filoleg wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not if you get a VPN. Even though you should pay for it, it is till cheaper than traveling 40 miles in a truck.

Is it though? It is often arou d $3-4 a month. If you go there once a month I'm not sure it's worth it

1 gallon of gas in my state is currently between $3.50 and $4. 40 miles each way is 80 miles total. The guy from the article will save money by driving his truck instead of using a VPN, but only if he goes shopping once a month, and his truck gets over 80mpg (miles per gallon). This way, he spends exactly that one gallon over the whole trip, which will conveniently make the gas expenses equal to the monthly price of a VPN (not even counting the wear and tear on the car, but that’s another story).

To demonstrate how implausible this is:

* Toyota Prius (hybrid) - 50/53mpg

* Honda Accord (entry level sedan) - 30/38mpg

* Ford F150 (small pickup truck) - 20/26mpg

And that’s only for the latest year models. If his truck is 10+ years old or larger than F150, expect mpg to be way more disastrous.

Re: Never-Googlers: Web users take the ultimate step to guard their data

#69

Post by npongratz »

eejjjj82 wrote: post #37

" In the small South Carolina town of Newberry, Bob's Red Mill muesli cereal is hard to come by. That presents a challenge for resident Gregory Kelly, who can't get enough of the stuff. He'd rather not truck the 40 miles or so to Columbia to stock up on it, but he's also loath to buy it from the company's website, which he says is riddled with tracking software from Google" Somebody get this man a Firefox Privacy Tab

TFA continues: '"I'm just not sure why Google needs to know what breakfast cereal I eat," the 51-year-old said.'

I hope Mr. Kelly is a pseudonym for the article. If not, Big Geez now knows his breakfast cereal proclivities.

For what it's worth, I'm in full sympathy of his plight, and agree that advertiser surveillance is creepy, dangerous, and evil.

Re: Never-Googlers: Web users take the ultimate step to guard their data

#70

Post by lern_too_spel »

babypuncher wrote: post #18
Animats wrote: post #2

Well, of course. Just don't sign up for a Google account. When you get an Android phone new, there's a moment when it asks you to sign up or sign in with a Google account. There's a "later" option". Click that, and then remove the Google one-time startup program. Install F-Droid, and get your apps from there. The mail program on Android will talk to an IMAP server. Find one to use, and you don't need Gmail. No ads. O…

Google tracking is baked into Android pretty deep. Simply not having an account doesn't stop Google from tracking what you do on your phone.

> Google tracking is baked into Android pretty deep

Citation needed.

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