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Chinese are big customers for schemes selling foreign residency

economist.com

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Re: Chinese are big customers for schemes selling foreign residency

#51

Post by filoleg »

damnyou wrote: post #33
coolspot wrote: post #17

It is large industry. More than one of my acquaintances got their green card and then citizenship by paying $20-$30k for fake marriage to a US citizen.

Another frame: your acquaintances were frustrated at how hard it is to immigrate and figured out a workaround. I strongly believe in freedom of movement so any legal or extra-legal means to do so are all right in my book. Rules are meant to be bent. Laws are meant to be broken.

>I strongly believe in freedom of movement so any legal or extra-legal means to do so are all right in my book.

>Laws are meant to be broken.

Those two statements sound a bit conflicting to me. Also, I don’t know how one can call green card marriage fraud “bending the rules” or a “workaround”. It is literally lying to USCIS in order to obtain a green card under false pretenses.

Re: Chinese are big customers for schemes selling foreign residency

#52

Post by thenewwazoo »

BooneJS wrote: post #46

Our son used to go to a HS in the east bay where foreign nationals would pay residents of the high school to essentially adopt their kid so they could enroll, take every AP and Honors class possible, and get into a UC campus. It’s crazy. We actually hated the public schools and moved away.

That's interesting, back east we called those kids "exchange students" and they were generally academically excellent, as well as adding to the diversity of the student body. And then they did well and got into US universities where they would presumably continue to excel academically.

I fail to see the problem.

Re: Chinese are big customers for schemes selling foreign residency

#53

Post by filoleg »

theflyinghorse wrote: post #24
rootsudo wrote: post #2

This has always been a common theme in Asia/South East Asia and is nothing new. The biggest barriers are: 1. Money/Income 2. Language. 3. Education. You can't fit in if you don't know the language, or literate. That's what makes Student visas so valuable, because it can give an anchor to an family to move abroad. Education, you can't survive abroad w/o income and this is usually hand in hand w/ a degree. Money, well,…

> You can't fit in if you don't know the language or literature I would invite you to visit Richmond BC which happens to be majority Asian (on top of my head 72% +) and majority of that Chinese. A Chinese national moving to Richmond would not struggle too much without English language. Why did you mention literature at all?

>Why did you mention literature at all?

Not OP, but being literate has a very tangential relationship to literature, so I think you might have just misunderstood what he meant by that word.

Re: Chinese are big customers for schemes selling foreign residency

#54

Post by damnyou »

filoleg wrote: post #51
damnyou wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another frame: your acquaintances were frustrated at how hard it is to immigrate and figured out a workaround. I strongly believe in freedom of movement so any legal or extra-legal means to do so are all right in my book. Rules are meant to be bent. Laws are meant to be broken.

>I strongly believe in freedom of movement so any legal or extra-legal means to do so are all right in my book. >Laws are meant to be broken. Those two statements sound a bit conflicting to me. Also, I don’t know how one can call green card marriage fraud “bending the rules” or a “workaround”. It is literally lying to USCIS in order to obtain a green card under false pretenses.

If they are legally married then how is it fraud? The entire idea of marriage fraud is bogus — it's just another invention used to justify state violence against a disfavored group. Marriages exist in all shapes and forms, many more than the state can think of.

For example USCIS apparently puts some people through interviews where they ask for intimate personal details of the spouse, like what side of the bed they sleep on or the color of the toothbrush they use. This implies a particular definition of marriage — one where you sleep on the same bed and use the same bathroom. Yet I know plenty of happily married folks who have generally separate lives, including having separate intimate relationships. That doesn't make their marriages any less valid!

Re: Chinese are big customers for schemes selling foreign residency

#55

Post by BooneJS »

thenewwazoo wrote: post #52
BooneJS wrote: post #46

Our son used to go to a HS in the east bay where foreign nationals would pay residents of the high school to essentially adopt their kid so they could enroll, take every AP and Honors class possible, and get into a UC campus. It’s crazy. We actually hated the public schools and moved away.

That's interesting, back east we called those kids "exchange students" and they were generally academically excellent, as well as adding to the diversity of the student body. And then they did well and got into US universities where they would presumably continue to excel academically. I fail to see the problem.

I remember foreign exchange students coming for a year, and they were never adopted by the host family. I guess the Midwest was different than your experience.

Re: Chinese are big customers for schemes selling foreign residency

#56

Post by [deleted] »

dragonwriter wrote: post #36
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not sure ad hominem applies, since it isn’t trying to discredit his argument by nature of his background. The comment is definitely off topic and doesn’t add anything to the discussion, however.

> I’m not sure ad hominem applies, since it isn’t trying to discredit his argument by nature of his background It literally asks that his argument be dismissed because of his his personal conduct; it is textbook ad hominem .

[deleted]

Re: Chinese are big customers for schemes selling foreign residency

#57

Post by [deleted] »

theflyinghorse wrote: post #24
rootsudo wrote: post #2

This has always been a common theme in Asia/South East Asia and is nothing new. The biggest barriers are: 1. Money/Income 2. Language. 3. Education. You can't fit in if you don't know the language, or literate. That's what makes Student visas so valuable, because it can give an anchor to an family to move abroad. Education, you can't survive abroad w/o income and this is usually hand in hand w/ a degree. Money, well,…

> You can't fit in if you don't know the language or literature I would invite you to visit Richmond BC which happens to be majority Asian (on top of my head 72% +) and majority of that Chinese. A Chinese national moving to Richmond would not struggle too much without English language. Why did you mention literature at all?

[deleted]

Re: Chinese are big customers for schemes selling foreign residency

#58

Post by seanmcdirmid »

dragonwriter wrote: post #36
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not sure ad hominem applies, since it isn’t trying to discredit his argument by nature of his background. The comment is definitely off topic and doesn’t add anything to the discussion, however.

> I’m not sure ad hominem applies, since it isn’t trying to discredit his argument by nature of his background It literally asks that his argument be dismissed because of his his personal conduct; it is textbook ad hominem .

It depends if it was Thiel’s argument or not. I’m not quite sure because of the thread history, there was something about his book and another about people who have multiple passports.

Re: Chinese are big customers for schemes selling foreign residency

#60

Post by chance_state »

damnyou wrote: post #33
coolspot wrote: post #17

It is large industry. More than one of my acquaintances got their green card and then citizenship by paying $20-$30k for fake marriage to a US citizen.

Another frame: your acquaintances were frustrated at how hard it is to immigrate and figured out a workaround. I strongly believe in freedom of movement so any legal or extra-legal means to do so are all right in my book. Rules are meant to be bent. Laws are meant to be broken.

>I strongly believe in freedom of movement [...]

Why?

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