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Reddit AMA: I'm a Former Amazon Fulfillment Center Employee

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Re: Reddit AMA: I'm a Former Amazon Fulfillment Center Employee

#81

Amazon Warehouse jobs have been well above minimum wage for quite some time. They are difficult, but warehouse jobs are not easy. I feel like there is a generational gap where people are expecting a comfortable office job. It's hardly slavery. It's a choice. You an always go somewhere else to work. Amazon doesn't have a monopoly on low-skilled labor jobs. I've known plenty of people that have worked in an Amazon Ware…

>It's hardly slavery. It's a choice.

This mode of thinking makes a dangerous assumption - that any issue can be resolved simply by an individual action. It assumes that because one person is making the complaint, then the issue which the complaint attempts to access must therefore be individual. It's an anti-political stance; politics isn't only about individuals, it's about creating a better society at large.

Let's say that it really is such an easy choice as you're describing. It's implausible that it's the case for every worker who feels mistreated there. Therefore your solution means to them we say "tough shit". This is one consequence of the divorce of economy and politics. In no political situation is it viable in rhetoric or otherwise to say "tough shit" to a group of people. But it's fine to say that in economic circumstances. The examples go on - most of us are in favour of democracy in the political sphere, because we believe we should have a say over our lives, but in the anarchic economic sphere in which pressures arise which are extremely compelling (so compelling that there are even markets for selling one's own organs) we balk at the idea of democracy.

This is why I'm in favour of economic democracy - to stop statements like "It's a choice. You can go somewhere else." from being the end of these discussions, and to take away their logical basis which falsely assumes democracy should be relegated to politics.

Re: Reddit AMA: I'm a Former Amazon Fulfillment Center Employee

#82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing is, their is a reason they say "modern day slavery" and not "slavery." The implication here is that just because there are no actual whips, no literal rape, and no families torn apart forever doesn't mean we should think this is acceptable. It's the modern equivalent of slavery. No, it's not slavery with whips and rape. It's a different type of slavery. Hence the qualifier. Anyways, I did you the service of…

I appreciate you taking the time to reply with why you believe the other poster is wrong. Too many people just downvote and move on without giving the opportunity to let others learn. However, I think you're wrong. There is slavery today with rape, murder, physical control, etc. When I see "Modern day slavery" or the "modern equivalent" is still just "slavery".

There is indeed slavery today with rape, murder and physical control - so I don't think the term "modern day slavery" is accurate save for some explanation as to what the "modern day" part means. Language doesn't necessarily work in a linear way - it's entirely possible for "slavery", "modern slavery" and "modern day slavery" to all refer to different concepts. Someone else in this same comment thread even uses the term "old-school slavery". Nevertheless, the term "wage slavery" has gained increasing usage, and comparisons of the wage system to slavery go back a long time, even when the plight of slaves was evident at the time. Keep in mind that the author of this quote was an ardent abolitionist too:

>The only difference as compared with the old, outspoken slavery is this, that the worker of today seems to be free because he is not sold once for all, but piecemeal by the day, the week, the year, and because no one owner sells him to another, but he is forced to sell himself in this way instead, being the slave of no particular person, but of the whole property-holding class.

Re: Reddit AMA: I'm a Former Amazon Fulfillment Center Employee

#83

I see “modern day slavery” and I stop reading. There are no whips. No rape. No families torn apart. No slave ships. Grow up people.

>I see “modern day slavery” and I stop reading. There are no whips. No rape. No families torn apart. No slave ships. Grow up people. You stopped reading because there were no practices of old school slavery in the so called modern day slavery?

Modern days slavery is still slavery... Blood diamond harvesting, US prisoners used as unpaid work force, sex workers, sweat shops in foreign countries.

Amazon work conditions suck, but not modern day slavery bad.

Re: Reddit AMA: I'm a Former Amazon Fulfillment Center Employee

#84

Amazon Warehouse jobs have been well above minimum wage for quite some time. They are difficult, but warehouse jobs are not easy. I feel like there is a generational gap where people are expecting a comfortable office job. It's hardly slavery. It's a choice. You an always go somewhere else to work. Amazon doesn't have a monopoly on low-skilled labor jobs. I've known plenty of people that have worked in an Amazon Ware…

>It's hardly slavery. It's a choice. This mode of thinking makes a dangerous assumption - that any issue can be resolved simply by an individual action. It assumes that because one person is making the complaint, then the issue which the complaint attempts to access must therefore be individual. It's an anti-political stance; politics isn't only about individuals, it's about creating a better society at large. Let's…

There are norms that already prevent (non-military) hired workers from e.g. working more than 168 h/no, or prescribe at least 2 weeks of paid leave a year.

I think these norms can be used / extended as needed.

Re: Reddit AMA: I'm a Former Amazon Fulfillment Center Employee

#85
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It's hardly slavery. It's a choice. This mode of thinking makes a dangerous assumption - that any issue can be resolved simply by an individual action. It assumes that because one person is making the complaint, then the issue which the complaint attempts to access must therefore be individual. It's an anti-political stance; politics isn't only about individuals, it's about creating a better society at large. Let's…

There are norms that already prevent (non-military) hired workers from e.g. working more than 168 h/no, or prescribe at least 2 weeks of paid leave a year. I think these norms can be used / extended as needed.

Within the capitalist system, of course - that's how it works. The capitalist fights to increase the working day (either in time- or piece-wages) while workers fight to decrease the working day. It's an endless tug of war between capital and labour. Ultimately, though, I don't think it solves much. The whole logical system and ideological analysis goes beyond simple adjustments to various quantities.

Re: Reddit AMA: I'm a Former Amazon Fulfillment Center Employee

#86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing is, their is a reason they say "modern day slavery" and not "slavery." The implication here is that just because there are no actual whips, no literal rape, and no families torn apart forever doesn't mean we should think this is acceptable. It's the modern equivalent of slavery. No, it's not slavery with whips and rape. It's a different type of slavery. Hence the qualifier. Anyways, I did you the service of…

I appreciate you taking the time to reply with why you believe the other poster is wrong. Too many people just downvote and move on without giving the opportunity to let others learn. However, I think you're wrong. There is slavery today with rape, murder, physical control, etc. When I see "Modern day slavery" or the "modern equivalent" is still just "slavery".

> There is slavery today

Yes, there is. That's slavery.

> When I see "Modern day slavery" or the "modern equivalent" is still just "slavery".

I don't understand. It seems like you missed a word, and however I try, I cannot figure out what you mean.

Re: Reddit AMA: I'm a Former Amazon Fulfillment Center Employee

#87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing is, their is a reason they say "modern day slavery" and not "slavery." The implication here is that just because there are no actual whips, no literal rape, and no families torn apart forever doesn't mean we should think this is acceptable. It's the modern equivalent of slavery. No, it's not slavery with whips and rape. It's a different type of slavery. Hence the qualifier. Anyways, I did you the service of…

Slaves couldn't quit their jobs if they were unhappy about it. That is one of the defining aspects of slavery.

If your choice is unemployment and not being able to afford the basic necessities, what choice do you have?

I mean, sure, you could quit and give up those those things. But then by that line of thinking, slaves could technically stop being slaves if they wanted to.

In both cases, the individuals are worse off. But I don't think that's the bar we should be shooting for.

I guess the real question is: are you okay with conditions Amazon has for it's Fulfillment center employees? Or are you just wasting people's time whining about the word "slavery?"

Re: Reddit AMA: I'm a Former Amazon Fulfillment Center Employee

#88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Slaves couldn't quit their jobs if they were unhappy about it. That is one of the defining aspects of slavery.

If your choice is unemployment and not being able to afford the basic necessities, what choice do you have? I mean, sure, you could quit and give up those those things. But then by that line of thinking, slaves could technically stop being slaves if they wanted to. In both cases, the individuals are worse off. But I don't think that's the bar we should be shooting for. I guess the real question is: are you okay with…

The choice would be looking for another job. A choice that slaves didn't have. By your definition, everybody is a slave, who is not so rich that they can afford to stop working.

As for Amazon's Fulfillment centers, I'd like to read a statement by their operators before making a judgement. I suspect it is not as easy to make unskilled workers do useful work as many people think.

Re: Reddit AMA: I'm a Former Amazon Fulfillment Center Employee

#89
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> warehouse jobs are not easy I did a few in my post-graduation days (as the joke goes, "do you want fries with that?"). There's nothing notably hard about them. > have been well above minimum wage for quite some time be lovely if you could give some figures, ta

Amazon's starting wage is $15 / hour.

Wasn't this brought by Bernie's campaigning, and proposing the Stop BEZOS Act?

Re: Reddit AMA: I'm a Former Amazon Fulfillment Center Employee

#90
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems that the US union law favors so called enterprise bargaining or worksite-level bargaining. Companies and workplaces either unionize or not. That kind of system pits unions against companies. If the workplace unionizes, non-unionized companies get an advantage. Whoever fucks their workers hardest gets competitive advantage. My experience of unions comes as an entrepreneur in countries with sectoral bargaining…

The whole let's run workers like machines idea because they are poor and they have no bargaining power is very closely akin to slavery and yet is tolerated... and not thought of as completely immoral. I mean how the fuck do you get away with limiting the ability of people to use the restroom.

OK first the Restroom issue...Can we Please LET THIS GO!!! There is NO RULE saying that I have a limit or restrictions on Restroom use. I can use the Restroom as much/often as I need. I have Never peed in a bottle or trash can Nor have I seen anyone does that either!! I have never gotten written up or in trouble for using the restroom. Really this rumor needs to be put to rest!! Its tired and old.

The last time I checked Slaves do not have Freedom and I have freedom to come and go as I please, Slaves do not get paid and I Get Paid VERY Well and get pay raises. Slaves do not get benefits and I get FULL Benefits with all the bells and whistles. I am NOT A Slave. There are no shackles over here.

Rachel-Amazon FC Ambassador

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