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America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

theatlantic.com

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Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#41

Post by iron0013 »

madhadron wrote: post #14

I look at it a little differently. The urban cores in the USA are actively hostile places for anyone to be. You step outside your door...into an empty hallway of doors. You take an elevator or stairs down to a place with a few mailboxes, then step outside. Outside, you have a narrow strip of concrete, possibly with a few trees, that you are allowed to inhabit. Beyond it is as asphalt with two ton steel contraptions w…

Your description doesn't really sound like any actual city that I know of, although it sounds a little like how someone who's never been to New York City might describe it. Do you have a particular city in mind? Because "car-centric and pedestrian hostile" sounds more like most suburbs than most urban areas.

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#42

Post by antisthenes »

raducu wrote: post #35
kaesar14 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But...we do?

I guess not enough? I don't want to sound like an asshole, I only have one child myself and I'm seriously considering stopping at one, I don't think childless people should be punished, but taxes should be steadily increased over time and incentivise child rearing until birthrates become sustainable again. I realy think the situation described in the article is somewhat akin to colonialism/slave trade where you have…

> taxes should be steadily increased over time and incentivise child rearing until birthrates become sustainable again.

How exactly do you define sustainable here? Sustainable what?

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#43

Post by fzeroracer »

raducu wrote: post #35
kaesar14 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But...we do?

I guess not enough? I don't want to sound like an asshole, I only have one child myself and I'm seriously considering stopping at one, I don't think childless people should be punished, but taxes should be steadily increased over time and incentivise child rearing until birthrates become sustainable again. I realy think the situation described in the article is somewhat akin to colonialism/slave trade where you have…

Okay, how does this work realistically? What about people that are sterile? Or people who choose to not have children due to their genetic history? Or what if they literally cannot afford to have children?

And what does sustainable mean in this context? Is every nation supposed to have a positive growth of population into perpetuity?

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#44

Post by sanderjd »

tcbawo wrote: post #28
madhadron wrote: post #14

I look at it a little differently. The urban cores in the USA are actively hostile places for anyone to be. You step outside your door...into an empty hallway of doors. You take an elevator or stairs down to a place with a few mailboxes, then step outside. Outside, you have a narrow strip of concrete, possibly with a few trees, that you are allowed to inhabit. Beyond it is as asphalt with two ton steel contraptions w…

In the large city where I live, green spaces and parks are flourishing. There are many cultural amenities for children (zoos, museums, libraries). There is also a large ecosystem of for-profit child care/play spaces. Cars are everywhere, but bike sharing, bike lanes, and public transportation are also available. I'm not sure that the city is an unfriendly a place for small children . The biggest problem with all of t…

Yeah I was thinking this as I read the parent comment. Everything they said is true, but it's also true that there is a lot for kids to do in those places. The comment about plopping kids in front of screens applies more so to the suburbs than to downtown! What are kids supposed to do in their neighborhood? Letting kids wander and play outside is seen as basically criminal, and there's nothing else to do.

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#45

Post by finolex1 »

madhadron wrote: post #14

I look at it a little differently. The urban cores in the USA are actively hostile places for anyone to be. You step outside your door...into an empty hallway of doors. You take an elevator or stairs down to a place with a few mailboxes, then step outside. Outside, you have a narrow strip of concrete, possibly with a few trees, that you are allowed to inhabit. Beyond it is as asphalt with two ton steel contraptions w…

It doesn't have to be low rise housing. Look at Singapore for an example of how high density, high-rise housing can coexist with plentiful public spaces.

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#46

Post by golemiprague »

madhadron wrote: post #14

I look at it a little differently. The urban cores in the USA are actively hostile places for anyone to be. You step outside your door...into an empty hallway of doors. You take an elevator or stairs down to a place with a few mailboxes, then step outside. Outside, you have a narrow strip of concrete, possibly with a few trees, that you are allowed to inhabit. Beyond it is as asphalt with two ton steel contraptions w…

This sounds like a very American view of things, most of the world has different city structure and different suburbs structure.

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#47

Post by georgeburdell »

tathougies wrote: post #15
coldtea wrote: post #4

> There are many reasons New York might be shrinking, but most of them come down to the same unavoidable fact: Raising a family in the city is just too hard. Harder than in the 20s, 30s, 40s, 50s, up to 80s? Millions of dirt poor immigrants raised children in the city just fine, and tons of working and middle class people were born and raised there. I seriously doubt it's "too hard" in any other sense, except job/ren…

Yeah seriously. We're Catholic (the crazy kind who eschew birth control and have tons of babies). We live in the SF area and are moving to Portland and plan on buying in the city. We have lots of friends in SF who have large enough families (3 - 8 kids). These are not super wealthy people. Well, I mean, they save their money and spend wisely so they have enough. They are not hotshot doctors, lawyers, or software engi…

Not sure subjugating women to be home makers is going to win a lot support for your point. The problem is that there is no support in the U.S. for working couples who choose to move away from family for economic opportunity.

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#48

Post by knolax »

madhadron wrote: post #14

I look at it a little differently. The urban cores in the USA are actively hostile places for anyone to be. You step outside your door...into an empty hallway of doors. You take an elevator or stairs down to a place with a few mailboxes, then step outside. Outside, you have a narrow strip of concrete, possibly with a few trees, that you are allowed to inhabit. Beyond it is as asphalt with two ton steel contraptions w…

Literally everything you said also applies to the suburbs though.

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#49

Post by magduf »

madhadron wrote: post #14

I look at it a little differently. The urban cores in the USA are actively hostile places for anyone to be. You step outside your door...into an empty hallway of doors. You take an elevator or stairs down to a place with a few mailboxes, then step outside. Outside, you have a narrow strip of concrete, possibly with a few trees, that you are allowed to inhabit. Beyond it is as asphalt with two ton steel contraptions w…

You don't need "low rise cohousing communities" to have families in cities. Japanese cities are extremely dense, yet people raise families there just fine. On my trip to Japan, I was really struck by how many children I saw in the middles of cities (moreso in some districts than others, of course), whereas I never see children in downtown American cities.

Of course, Japanese cities don't have enormous parking lots, everyone driving cars, etc. They have taxis of course, and some cars (not a lot really, given the population), and work vehicles, but not the huge amount of vehicle traffic we have. And of course, there's tons of trains and buses, so it's really cheap and easy to get around by public transit. On top of that, there's bicycles: tons of people get around by bicycle, and the traffic level and speeds are low enough to make this very safe, plus there's no culture there of being aggressive towards cyclists or pedestrians the way America has.

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#50

Post by kaesar14 »

raducu wrote: post #35
kaesar14 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But...we do?

I guess not enough? I don't want to sound like an asshole, I only have one child myself and I'm seriously considering stopping at one, I don't think childless people should be punished, but taxes should be steadily increased over time and incentivise child rearing until birthrates become sustainable again. I realy think the situation described in the article is somewhat akin to colonialism/slave trade where you have…

I don't see why the government should be levying increasing taxes on something as personal as having a child.
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