Amazon workers launch protests on Prime Day • Hacker News Board

Re: Amazon workers launch protests on Prime Day

#301

Post by eloisant » Tue, Jul 16, 2019, 2:11 AM UTC

mdorazio wrote: post #49

enlyth wrote: post #15

I agree with the worker in the video, they should be treated as human beings. One of the issues is doing a simple, monotonous task every 8 seconds, 10 hours a day, 5 days a week, without creating anything of value, is going to be dehumanizing and unfulfilling regardless. Robots carrying out this work would probably be for the best for everyone involved, although Amazon should do right by the workers carrying them ove…

> The compensation should reflect the mental and physical stress they put people through. As with all companies paying workers to do a job, the compensation should reflect the confluence of supply and demand in the market. The fact that Amazon can easily hire as many workers as it wants at $15/hr says that they are paying their employees plenty already. It bothers me that people are constantly demonizing Amazon for t…

> It bothers me that people are constantly demonizing Amazon for their labor practices rather than demonizing the market conditions that have led to Amazon warehouses being a place people are willing to work.

The thing is that Amazon largely contributed to create those market conditions, by getting the consumer used to free next day delivery (same delivery in some places). And by squeezing their workers like this, forcing other online retailers to follow if they want to stay competitive.

Re: Amazon workers launch protests on Prime Day

#302

Post by fuzz4lyfe » Tue, Jul 16, 2019, 2:13 AM UTC

mikeash wrote: post #298

fuzz4lyfe wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So they are to run at a loss? Why not simply close down the warehouses and liberate these poor people from these terrible jobs?

Who said anything about running at a loss? I’m just stating that they can pay more by taking less of a profit, “the market” doesn’t stop them.

They only make $5000 per worker per year or so, given that the stock market has consistent returns of about 7% lately it's getting to the point that it would be better to put that money there was opposed to paying workers with it for such small returns.

Re: Amazon workers launch protests on Prime Day

#303

Post by cyphar » Tue, Jul 16, 2019, 2:17 AM UTC

BurningFrog wrote: post #299

Since Amazon easily hires and retains people at these wages, there very likely isn't anything wrong with these jobs. At least not compared to similar jobs for the same segment of the work force. What I think is really going on here is that Amazon has a PR vulnerability that can be exploited. With enough videos and testimony produced contrasting the plight of the poor oppressed workers with their boss, The World's Ric…

> Since Amazon easily hires and retains people at these wages, there very likely isn't anything wrong with these jobs. At least not compared to similar jobs for the same segment of the work force.

I agree that there are almost certainly many other examples of inhumane treatment of low-wage workers. We should fix those too. If low-wage workers had unions then you would be able to have those kinds of cross-industry group actions.

But no, the work conditions at Amazon are not acceptable. And to pretend that this a free market transaction -- and not a case of people who are desperate (and probably being forced to work several jobs and depend on government programs due to inhumanely low wages) being exploited.

Re: Amazon workers launch protests on Prime Day

#304

Post by cyphar » Tue, Jul 16, 2019, 2:21 AM UTC

mdorazio wrote: post #49

enlyth wrote: post #15

I agree with the worker in the video, they should be treated as human beings. One of the issues is doing a simple, monotonous task every 8 seconds, 10 hours a day, 5 days a week, without creating anything of value, is going to be dehumanizing and unfulfilling regardless. Robots carrying out this work would probably be for the best for everyone involved, although Amazon should do right by the workers carrying them ove…

> The compensation should reflect the mental and physical stress they put people through. As with all companies paying workers to do a job, the compensation should reflect the confluence of supply and demand in the market. The fact that Amazon can easily hire as many workers as it wants at $15/hr says that they are paying their employees plenty already. It bothers me that people are constantly demonizing Amazon for t…

> It bothers me that people are constantly demonizing Amazon for their labor practices rather than demonizing the market conditions that have led to Amazon warehouses being a place people are willing to work.

There's no reason we can't do both. Unfortunately, once you start criticising capitalism (which inevitably leads to these types of employee-employer abuses without unions or other legislation) you get called a communist (incorrectly) and the discussion is over.

Re: Amazon workers launch protests on Prime Day

#305

Post by dymk » Tue, Jul 16, 2019, 2:21 AM UTC

BurningFrog wrote: post #299

Since Amazon easily hires and retains people at these wages, there very likely isn't anything wrong with these jobs. At least not compared to similar jobs for the same segment of the work force. What I think is really going on here is that Amazon has a PR vulnerability that can be exploited. With enough videos and testimony produced contrasting the plight of the poor oppressed workers with their boss, The World's Ric…

When you employ hundreds of thousands of people, it’s not hard to find hundreds who are incredibly unhappy. Sure, this only represents 0.1% of their workforce, but news agencies don’t care about that. People just want something to be angry about.

They’ll continue to ignore that $15/hour is within “living wage” for the low CoL areas that Amazon fulfillment warehouses are located in.

Re: Amazon workers launch protests on Prime Day

#306

Post by dymk » Tue, Jul 16, 2019, 2:21 AM UTC

cyphar wrote: post #303

BurningFrog wrote: post #299

Since Amazon easily hires and retains people at these wages, there very likely isn't anything wrong with these jobs. At least not compared to similar jobs for the same segment of the work force. What I think is really going on here is that Amazon has a PR vulnerability that can be exploited. With enough videos and testimony produced contrasting the plight of the poor oppressed workers with their boss, The World's Ric…

> Since Amazon easily hires and retains people at these wages, there very likely isn't anything wrong with these jobs. At least not compared to similar jobs for the same segment of the work force. I agree that there are almost certainly many other examples of inhumane treatment of low-wage workers. We should fix those too. If low-wage workers had unions then you would be able to have those kinds of cross-industry gro…

$15/hour is “inhumanly low”? Since when?

Amazon has been a leader in paying unskilled workers a good salary at huge scale.

Re: Amazon workers launch protests on Prime Day

#307

Post by jodrellblank » Tue, Jul 16, 2019, 2:28 AM UTC

icelancer wrote: post #53

fao_ wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a company cannot pay it's workers properly then, to be honest, it really shouldn't exist.

People keep seeming to apply for jobs at Amazon warehouses making $15-16/hr, so...

so ... what?

People keep turning up to work on third world garbage dumps for cents/day earnings, so...

Re: Amazon workers launch protests on Prime Day

#308

Post by andrepd » Tue, Jul 16, 2019, 2:34 AM UTC

dymk wrote: post #306

cyphar wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Since Amazon easily hires and retains people at these wages, there very likely isn't anything wrong with these jobs. At least not compared to similar jobs for the same segment of the work force. I agree that there are almost certainly many other examples of inhumane treatment of low-wage workers. We should fix those too. If low-wage workers had unions then you would be able to have those kinds of cross-industry gro…

$15/hour is “inhumanly low”? Since when? Amazon has been a leader in paying unskilled workers a good salary at huge scale.

It's not just the salary, it's the working conditions.

Re: Amazon workers launch protests on Prime Day

#309

Post by dang » Tue, Jul 16, 2019, 2:34 AM UTC

fake-name wrote: post #251

dang wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personal attacks are not ok here, regardless of how provocative another comment is. Please review the site guidelines: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html . If you'd take their spirit to heart, we'd be grateful.

It's not an attack, it's a statement. The OP here is literally saying "I want cheap shipping and I don't care if the companies providing it actually hurt people just to save a few cents". I can't think of any way to respond that isn't pointing out that holding that position makes you a monster.

Attacks can be statements.

Not responding is always an option, and in a case like this it's the right option, as expressed by the ancient internet adage "please don't feed the trolls". The site guidelines ask the same, albeit less colorfully.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Amazon workers launch protests on Prime Day

#310

Post by jodrellblank » Tue, Jul 16, 2019, 2:35 AM UTC

honopu wrote: post #20

SmileyRedBall wrote: post #8

What would it effect Bezos Net Worth to double the warehouse operatives hourly rate to $22?

not relevant, free market, they decide to work there, or not.

A free market would allow the employees to unionise to negotiate more effectively the employee side, like Amazon the company uses many people collectively to negotiate the employer side. But Amazon is anti-union and spends money to that effect.

If the free market is a fair market, unionising wouldn't make any difference as the negotiated rates would already be fair and couldn't be any more fair. Amazon wouldn't be spending money to block union efforts, because that would be wasted money. Therefore either this isn't free market, and your comment is wrong (not free market), or this is free market but it isn't fair so your comment is wrong (free market, yet still relevant).