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No limit: AI poker bot is first to beat professionals at multiplayer game

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Re: No limit: AI poker bot is first to beat professionals at multiplayer game

#391

Post by bryanrasmussen »

loup-vaillant wrote: post #377
bryanrasmussen wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Italy 1.8 seems accurate, in my experience most Italians know only Italian, although younger generations are likely to know a bit of English. The surprising thing for me is Germany having 2. Seems unlikely.

> The surprising thing for me is Germany having 2. Seems unlikely. Germany is big. I've heard that the proficiency in foreign languages tends to decrease as your country gets bigger. Because the bigger the country, the less likely you are to interact with foreign languages. Bigger countries also tend to have foreign works translated (or dubbed) into their own language more often. So, no, I'm not surprised.

I was surprised it was not less.

Re: No limit: AI poker bot is first to beat professionals at multiplayer game

#392

Post by albedoa »

kevinwang wrote: post #386
albedoa wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> when it bets with a weak hand, the opponent (another copy of itself) sometimes folds and it makes more money than if it hadn't bet. This makes no sense. If I am betting for thin value with a weak hand, then I make less money when my opponent folds. Does the bot not know whether it is bluffing or value betting?

Where does your quote say that the bet is a value-bet? I read it as saying that the bot learned to bluff (not value bet) by betting when it has a weak hand (I.e. The bot has a weak hand, so it's getting better hands to fold by betting). The phrase "value bet"was not used. (This, in addition to what the other comments have said about there being spots where a bet can get better hands to fold with some probability AND…

I mean, unless only those who interpret it wrong would respond, then I must be the one reading it wrong. Because these responses aren't lining up with how I read it or what I meant.

Re: No limit: AI poker bot is first to beat professionals at multiplayer game

#393

Post by y4mi »

bryanrasmussen wrote: post #391
loup-vaillant wrote: post #377

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The surprising thing for me is Germany having 2. Seems unlikely. Germany is big. I've heard that the proficiency in foreign languages tends to decrease as your country gets bigger. Because the bigger the country, the less likely you are to interact with foreign languages. Bigger countries also tend to have foreign works translated (or dubbed) into their own language more often. So, no, I'm not surprised.

I was surprised it was not less.

At least a quarter of my city barely speaks german.

But they need to be able to get citizenship afaik... So basically everyone can speak two languages on paper, though their knowledge of the native one is extremely rudimentary

You're also required to learn 2 foreign languages in school if you want to go to university

Re: No limit: AI poker bot is first to beat professionals at multiplayer game

#394

Post by GuB-42 »

jacquesm wrote: post #296
thomasfl wrote: post #283

One of the researchers, Tuomas Sundholm, has a real badass CV. Former pilot in the Finnish airforce. Finnish windsurfer champion. Snowboarder. Professor at Carnegie Mellon. Speaks four european languages, including swedish. And now at the age of 51, he has created the best AI powered poker bot. https://www.cs.cmu.edu/~sandholm/cv.pdf

Not to belittle the man's other achievements but speaking four languages is pretty normal in Europe, except when you're from the UK.

French guy here: no.

French people can usually speak basic English, and a third language is common if that person has ties with another country but that's it. At school, we are normally taught two foreign languages. The first one is usually English, few people actually practice their second one.

The situation is completely different in Scandinavian countries. And it is indeed quite normal to speak 4 languages in Finland (usually Finnish, Swedish, English and a 4th one, often German). Because their native language is only spoken by a few, foreign languages are a necessity for international relationships. And as a Finnish friend told me, learning new languages is a popular way to pass time during long winter nights.

Re: No limit: AI poker bot is first to beat professionals at multiplayer game

#395

Post by vietbold »

bryanrasmussen wrote: post #368
nso wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Being Swedish I bet you at minimum can understand and communicate proficiently with speakers and writers of Swedish, Norwegian, Danish and English. Probably you learned either Spanish, French, or German in school as well? Nordic countries are a special case. Norden er et spesielt tilfelle. Norden är ett speciellt fall. Norden er et specielt tilfælde.

Nobody can communicate proficiently with the Danes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-mOy8VUEBk

Some of us have Danish heritage you insensitive rod.

Nøgen pige lærer sku å su pig

Danish for the transporting win

Re: No limit: AI poker bot is first to beat professionals at multiplayer game

#396

Post by vietbold »

kyleblarson wrote: post #350
thomasfl wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most norwegians only speak 2 languages. Swedish and danish is very similar to norwegian, more like dialects, so it doesn't count.

I am on holiday in Norway right now and have been super impressed by the english fluency of most people I have spoken with. It goes far beyond basic conversational fluency.

Go to the fucking outskirts and see how well it goes.

Re: No limit: AI poker bot is first to beat professionals at multiplayer game

#397

Post by vietbold »

alienallys wrote: post #339
everdev wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, but the bot needs to know who is in what position what the bets are, who folded, etc. Try inputting all of that information manually to the laptop next to you and you'll quickly get frustrated. Online poker is a fast game with lots of data points.

An external camera with Image processor does that

Or fucking screen grabbing the screen of the active computer. Less artifacts

Re: No limit: AI poker bot is first to beat professionals at multiplayer game

#398

Post by XalvinX »

confidantlake wrote: post #336
noambrown wrote: post #6

I'm one of the authors of the bot, AMA

Why would you choose Chris Ferguson to participate? Don't you know his terrible history?

maybe the fact that he hold a computer science degree figures into his involvement on some level? regarding his terrible history, was that ever really proven or admitted to? and if it was, why is he not in jail (or dead, for that matter...)?? my not-very-informed take on that situation was more like he was in the wrong place at the wrong time, black friday came along, and the money dried up really fast making for some unpaid debts for the company... perhaps i don't know the full story but still, he didn't seem to ever be charged with any wrongdoing, which seems odd to say the least

Re: No limit: AI poker bot is first to beat professionals at multiplayer game

#400

Post by albedoa »

kevinwang wrote: post #386
albedoa wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> when it bets with a weak hand, the opponent (another copy of itself) sometimes folds and it makes more money than if it hadn't bet. This makes no sense. If I am betting for thin value with a weak hand, then I make less money when my opponent folds. Does the bot not know whether it is bluffing or value betting?

Where does your quote say that the bet is a value-bet? I read it as saying that the bot learned to bluff (not value bet) by betting when it has a weak hand (I.e. The bot has a weak hand, so it's getting better hands to fold by betting). The phrase "value bet"was not used. (This, in addition to what the other comments have said about there being spots where a bet can get better hands to fold with some probability AND…

"At the end of the day, bluffing is simply betting when you have a weak hand."

I was the one who introduced the term "value betting" to the conversation, applied specifically to weak hands.

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