Live data from Hacker News

Claim of Superconductivity Above 0C

nextbigfuture.com

21–30 of 35 posts

Re: Claim of Superconductivity Above 0C

#21
post #6

I'll believe it when it's peer reviewed and reproduced.

It has been reproduced and journallized by Sharif University in Iran. It looks legit, but his spec sheet does indicate that there are problems with commercialisation. http://www.superconductors.org/276K.htm indicates how to reproduce and what results to expect. A regular freezer can sustain -5C to 5C. An ammonia freezer can go as low as -27C, so 3C is easy to hold. And the fact that he has been known for good results…

A regular freezer can go a lot lower than -5c, -20c is easy, every home freezer does that.

And ammonia can go far lower than -27, it can easily go below -60c.

Re: Claim of Superconductivity Above 0C

#22
post #6

I'll believe it when it's peer reviewed and reproduced.

It has been reproduced and journallized by Sharif University in Iran. It looks legit, but his spec sheet does indicate that there are problems with commercialisation. http://www.superconductors.org/276K.htm indicates how to reproduce and what results to expect. A regular freezer can sustain -5C to 5C. An ammonia freezer can go as low as -27C, so 3C is easy to hold. And the fact that he has been known for good results…

> It has been reproduced and journallized by Sharif University in Iran.

I see. Well I'll just wait for additional confirmation from the Great Leader's University of North Korea.

Re: Claim of Superconductivity Above 0C

#23
post #5

As a lapsed superconductivity physicist, I hate to burst the bubble. In the community there has been a long-standing joke about USOs, Unidentified Superconducting Objects, and it is well known that just because you see "Signs of Superconductivity" does not prove that something is superconducting. There are really three questions at hand: 1> Does the sample show the Meissner effect, 2> Does it show zero resistance, an…

I have no idea why you are getting upvoted. You're not bursting any bubble, you're just parading your cynicism and knowledge of a specialized field before a technical audience. The post http://www.superconductors.org/276K.htm contains a whole bunch of data which may answer your 3 points. How about you go through it, or email the author who has "released [the details] into the public domain without patent protection in order to encourage additional research" and get back to us? You ask, "Does the sample show the Meissner effect" and I ask you does the information provided supply you with the answer? In which case you should write, "the published research information does not provide any information regarding the Meissner effect" because otherwise it sounds like you didn't even look closely at the article. And 10 out of 10 for not explaining what the Meissner effect is by the way. The top graph on the linked to page has a portion of the plotted function circled and labelled Meissner transition, is this what you mean? From Wiki P: "The Meissner effect is the expulsion of a magnetic field from a superconductor during its transition to the superconducting state. Walther Meissner and Robert Ochsenfeld discovered the phenomenon in 1933 by measuring the magnetic field distribution outside superconducting tin and lead samples."

Is (Tl4Pb)Ba2MgCu8O13+ a ceramic compound? If not, why mention them? They are claiming superconductivity, so this implies zero resistance doesn't it? We can worry about impurities when we make enough of the stuff to extrude and bend it.

Re: Claim of Superconductivity Above 0C

#24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has been reproduced and journallized by Sharif University in Iran. It looks legit, but his spec sheet does indicate that there are problems with commercialisation. http://www.superconductors.org/276K.htm indicates how to reproduce and what results to expect. A regular freezer can sustain -5C to 5C. An ammonia freezer can go as low as -27C, so 3C is easy to hold. And the fact that he has been known for good results…

> It has been reproduced and journallized by Sharif University in Iran. I see. Well I'll just wait for additional confirmation from the Great Leader's University of North Korea.

The chair of Electrical Engineering Department of Stanford University has announced that: "Without a doubt the finest university in the world preparing undergraduate Electrical engineers is Sharif University of Technology in Tehran" -http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharif_University_of_Technology...

Re: Claim of Superconductivity Above 0C

#26
post #6

I'll believe it when it's peer reviewed and reproduced.

It has been reproduced and journallized by Sharif University in Iran. It looks legit, but his spec sheet does indicate that there are problems with commercialisation. http://www.superconductors.org/276K.htm indicates how to reproduce and what results to expect. A regular freezer can sustain -5C to 5C. An ammonia freezer can go as low as -27C, so 3C is easy to hold. And the fact that he has been known for good results…

> And the fact that he has been known for good results in the past shows, at least to me that this is the real thing.

It means that the claims should be taken seriously, since he's competent in the field, but he might have made a mistake somewhere (even though, from what I understand of his report, the results seem clear. But since I'm not even a physicist, my opinion is worth peanuts).

The peer reviewed confirmation of his previous discovery can be found here: http://www.superconductors.org/SDARTICL.pdf.

Re: Claim of Superconductivity Above 0C

#27
post #5

As a lapsed superconductivity physicist, I hate to burst the bubble. In the community there has been a long-standing joke about USOs, Unidentified Superconducting Objects, and it is well known that just because you see "Signs of Superconductivity" does not prove that something is superconducting. There are really three questions at hand: 1> Does the sample show the Meissner effect, 2> Does it show zero resistance, an…

I have no idea why you are getting upvoted. You're not bursting any bubble, you're just parading your cynicism and knowledge of a specialized field before a technical audience. The post http://www.superconductors.org/276K.htm contains a whole bunch of data which may answer your 3 points. How about you go through it, or email the author who has "released [the details] into the public domain without patent protection i…

The Meisner transition is the transition to a state where the Meisner effect is observed.

The author also reports a "resistive transition", 1°C lower than the Meisner transition. He claims that this signs the superconductivity of the material and confirms the origin of the magnetic transition.

> Is (Tl4Pb)Ba2MgCu8O13+ a ceramic compound?

Most probably, yes. See http://www.superconductors.org/type2.htm.

Re: Claim of Superconductivity Above 0C

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has been reproduced and journallized by Sharif University in Iran. It looks legit, but his spec sheet does indicate that there are problems with commercialisation. http://www.superconductors.org/276K.htm indicates how to reproduce and what results to expect. A regular freezer can sustain -5C to 5C. An ammonia freezer can go as low as -27C, so 3C is easy to hold. And the fact that he has been known for good results…

> It has been reproduced and journallized by Sharif University in Iran. I see. Well I'll just wait for additional confirmation from the Great Leader's University of North Korea.

Which large scale science project in the US had the highest number of "graduates" who went on to win nobel prizes and make gigantic contributions to science? The Manhattan Project.

Which countries are currently working on their own versions of that project? Uh, North Korea and Iran.

You can be DAMN sure that some of the best scientific minds outside of western main-stream are at the moment toiling away in Iran and North Korea.

Re: Claim of Superconductivity Above 0C

#29
post #19
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then, too, I also badly want to believe in the concept of one-man research published on a blog.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but I have to ask: why? I believe a great deal in the capability of individuals to accomplish great things, but I don't care how ingenious the methods, how confident the claims, how insightful the theory... I want to see science as a group activity. Because no matter how good you are, you need replication and criticism, and constant skeptical feedback. I'm not saying it's impossible to get…

Science as a whole can only be a group activity, of course - without replication of findings, it isn't really science (just mad science).

But the peer review process as it stands necessarily entails a certain barrier to entry. While we all would like to believe that every deserving idea gets peer review, in practice, most people don't have the time to bother with a submitted paper unless it's coming from an institution they've more or less heard of. How could it be otherwise? There are huge numbers of crackpots out there, and institutional affiliation is an efficient way of filtering them out.

My wife wants to do theoretical physics research (she's qualified: she has a doctorate in theoretical physics) but unless she's affiliated with an institution, it's unlikely she'll get anything published, or so she says. The problem is that unless you're a rock star, affiliation with an institution entails teaching, which in turn translates into all-out effort for roughly 22 hours a day by my own observations of the past semester. The resulting Catch-22 is that my wife can't reasonably do research at all, and that's illogical; she needs no resources but time and access to books and preprints, which she has at home.

So I'd like to see some research done using these new-fangled informational access tools we have now - research that is both sound and eventually makes its way into traditional peer review simply on the basis of its soundness, and not because the institutional affiliation of the researcher makes it plausible. This is one more thing that I think the Internet can do for us, and I'd like to see it happen.

Of course, the romantic in me just likes the idea of the lone mad scientist in his lair discovering room-temperature superconductivity, because that is the twenty-first century I signed up for. Today room-temperature superconductivity, tomorrow super-intelligent lab rats and cheap immortality. It's all good.

Re: Claim of Superconductivity Above 0C

#30
post #5

As a lapsed superconductivity physicist, I hate to burst the bubble. In the community there has been a long-standing joke about USOs, Unidentified Superconducting Objects, and it is well known that just because you see "Signs of Superconductivity" does not prove that something is superconducting. There are really three questions at hand: 1> Does the sample show the Meissner effect, 2> Does it show zero resistance, an…

I have no idea why you are getting upvoted. You're not bursting any bubble, you're just parading your cynicism and knowledge of a specialized field before a technical audience. The post http://www.superconductors.org/276K.htm contains a whole bunch of data which may answer your 3 points. How about you go through it, or email the author who has "released [the details] into the public domain without patent protection i…

You're not bursting any bubble, you're just parading your cynicism and knowledge of a specialized field before a technical audience.

In this case, I'd have to say that it's probably well deserved cynicism, though. An extremely effective first filter when any scientific or mathematical discovery is announced is to ask, "Does it look like science?", where "it" refers to whatever materials have been released.

In this case, the announcement does not look much like most science, and in fact the design reminds me more of all of those "Einstein was wrong, here's the real special theory of relativity!" sites than anything else.

This might not be a 100% correct filter, but I can't think of the last scientific breakthrough where the author didn't bother to at least set the paper in LaTeX and throw up a preprint somewhere. These days, even most incorrect proofs and discoveries look more like science than this does.

That said, as I know nothing about this field, I'd definitely be curious to hear what an expert had to say in about the specifics of these claims, as well as the other stuff at http://www.superconductors.org - it looks very crank-y to me, but then again I have known legit scientists that suck quite badly at web design, so who knows...

Post reply on HN