Solitary Jailhouse Lawyer Argues His Way Out of Prison • Hacker News Board

Re: Solitary Jailhouse Lawyer Argues His Way Out of Prison

#41

Post by vilya » Sat, Dec 25, 2010, 12:38 PM UTC

yxhuvud wrote: post #35

joe_the_user wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I reading the story, that part was just screaming at me. In my limited knowledge of the law, the guy got incredibly lucky in having illegally gain evidence accepted in a court of law (from a defendant). It's mind blowing to think about being in a situation where the only way to get justice is to break the law. It sounds good in action movie but in real life, it's appalling...

Being a foreigner, it's mind blowing that how evidence is procured matter. Evidence is evidence. If there were illegal actions while collecting it, then those actions should be prosecuted, but evidence is still evidence and should be used.

I believe (but cannot prove) that it's to prevent the police abusing their powers. If illegally gathered evidence were admissible, then they could argue - with some justification - that the end justifies the means.

Re: Solitary Jailhouse Lawyer Argues His Way Out of Prison

#42

Post by ditojim » Sat, Dec 25, 2010, 12:42 PM UTC

movie please.

Re: Solitary Jailhouse Lawyer Argues His Way Out of Prison

#43

Post by mobileed » Sat, Dec 25, 2010, 2:52 PM UTC

I feel anyone who abstruct justice by withholding evidence should automatically go to jail. This guy was railroaded on so many levels, the DA should go sit in jail for same amount of time this innocent person did.

Re: Solitary Jailhouse Lawyer Argues His Way Out of Prison

#44

Post by jonknee » Sat, Dec 25, 2010, 2:57 PM UTC

iwwr wrote: post #34

Detrus wrote: post #6

What are the typical consequences to the corrupt prosecutor and police department in a case like this?

Mike Nifong, the prosecutor in the Duke Lacrosse case was eventually disbarred and faces multi-million dollar lawsuits (which he will lose almost certainly). Although I think that is more the exception. Prosecutors face almost no downside to corruption.

And that's just because there was so much media attention (which was arguably because the accused were rich white guys).

Re: Solitary Jailhouse Lawyer Argues His Way Out of Prison

#45

Post by nokcha » Sat, Dec 25, 2010, 3:02 PM UTC

yxhuvud wrote: post #35

joe_the_user wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I reading the story, that part was just screaming at me. In my limited knowledge of the law, the guy got incredibly lucky in having illegally gain evidence accepted in a court of law (from a defendant). It's mind blowing to think about being in a situation where the only way to get justice is to break the law. It sounds good in action movie but in real life, it's appalling...

Being a foreigner, it's mind blowing that how evidence is procured matter. Evidence is evidence. If there were illegal actions while collecting it, then those actions should be prosecuted, but evidence is still evidence and should be used.

In the US, the courts crafted the "suppression of evidence" doctrine as a remedy to violations of the Fourth Amendment right to be secure against unreasonable searches/seizures. The courts didn't have the power to punish the law-enforcement agents who violated the Fourth Amendment (because there didn't exist an appropriate statute criminalizing the behavior or because the prosecutor was unwilling to bring charges), so instead they refused to allow such illegally gathered evidence to be presented at trial. Note that evidence gathered by a private actor (independently of any gov't investigation) is not suppressible under this doctrine.

Re: Solitary Jailhouse Lawyer Argues His Way Out of Prison

#46

Post by wallflower » Sat, Dec 25, 2010, 4:53 PM UTC

anigbrowl wrote: post #20

Detrus wrote: post #6

What are the typical consequences to the corrupt prosecutor and police department in a case like this?

The risk is low for the police department and virtually zero for a corrupt prosecutor or judge - in most cases they enjoy legal immunity because of the nature of their job. It's an imperfect system, but it's worth bearing in mind that taking away prosecutorial immunity would also lead to calls for defense attorneys to be punished if their clients were found guilty. The principle that an attorney can and should pursue…

I just heard Barry Gibbs tell his story on TheMoth's podcast.

> Framed by a corrupt cop, a man spends 19 unjust years in prison. Barry Gibbs was falsely accused of murder, and in 2006, after 19 years in prison, was exonerated with the help of The Innocence Project. New York City recently gave him the largest personal settlement in its history, 9.9 million dollars. The NYPD detective, Louis Eppolito, is now serving life in prison.

http://www.innocenceproject.org/Content/Barry_Gibbs.php

Re: Solitary Jailhouse Lawyer Argues His Way Out of Prison

#47

Post by gnaritas » Sat, Dec 25, 2010, 4:53 PM UTC

rdl wrote: post #39

This is one of many reasons I oppose capital punishment. It is odd that conservatives, who claim government is often the problem, not the solution, would entrust the state with the power of life and death.

Not really, as the conservative opinion has little to do with logic or consistency; it's all about maintaining the status quo. They simply dislike change, many seem to wish progress stopped around 1890 or so.

Re: Solitary Jailhouse Lawyer Argues His Way Out of Prison

#48

Post by c4urself » Sat, Dec 25, 2010, 5:31 PM UTC

from this story and others i read on HN: there is something really wrong with the justice system in america.

Re: Solitary Jailhouse Lawyer Argues His Way Out of Prison

#49

Post by Symmetry » Sat, Dec 25, 2010, 5:44 PM UTC

iwwr wrote: post #34

Detrus wrote: post #6

What are the typical consequences to the corrupt prosecutor and police department in a case like this?

Mike Nifong, the prosecutor in the Duke Lacrosse case was eventually disbarred and faces multi-million dollar lawsuits (which he will lose almost certainly). Although I think that is more the exception. Prosecutors face almost no downside to corruption.

But on the other hand, Martha Coakley just narrowly lost a senate election, so while there is some rare downside risk to prosecutorial misconduct, there's the potential upside of being elected to high office for being "tough on crime".

Re: Solitary Jailhouse Lawyer Argues His Way Out of Prison

#50

Post by Symmetry » Sat, Dec 25, 2010, 5:46 PM UTC

badmash69 wrote: post #16

Hey HN, I mean no disrespect to any of the parties in this story -- but hey isn't this forum about HACKER NEWS ? The only inspirational stores I wanna read about HERE are about fellow hackers' finding Seed/ VC funding and their successful exits. Or about cool programs and code. Items pertaining to Technology , Free Markets and Capitalism. For all other life-affirming and inspirational stuff , I could always go to red…

The notion that you ought to be willing to become an expert in any field if your need is great enough is entirely in line with the ethos of Hacker News.