Libra, 2 Weeks In • Hacker News Board

Re: Libra, 2 Weeks In

#11

Post by ajdlinux » Tue, Jul 09, 2019, 12:50 AM UTC

conanbatt wrote: post #8

r32a_ wrote: post #6

Let's call this for what it really is, they want to replace democracy with Corporatism. At least with a government backed currency we get a choice on who runs the government. Even though that power is constantly being eroded. The companies that run Libra however have 0 obligation to users of Libra but only to maximise profits for their shareholders. This is their plan: * Dedicate a lot of resources to spread the adop…

As a non-Us national, I prefer FB corporatism to US democracy. Puts more people on even ground.

As another non-US national, I still have far, far more faith in US democracy than FB corporatism.

In any case, the US isn't the only country in the world with a monetary policy that could get trampled over.

Re: Libra, 2 Weeks In

#12

Post by diab0lic » Tue, Jul 09, 2019, 12:52 AM UTC

r32a_ wrote: post #7

wmf wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin is the oldest and thus technically least advanced cryptocurrency. There are plenty of coins that are much better than Bitcoin in terms of privacy and scalability; Libra should be compared against these.

Wrong. Bitcoin will use Lightning Network for most everyday transactions and it's speed is only limited by network liquidity and bandwidth

Genuinely curious: Does the lightning network provide all of the same guarantees that the standard Bitcoin network provides? What are the downsides? Why isn't the lightning network used all the time instead of the Bitcoin protocol?

Re: Libra, 2 Weeks In

#13

Post by whatshisface » Tue, Jul 09, 2019, 12:55 AM UTC

mromanuk wrote: post #9

Call me pessimist, but cartelized private global corporations owning and “printing” money can only bring bad things. It is centralized and is controlled by an elite.

The Fed isn't? It has more private board members than appointed board members, and some have argued that it has consistently prioritized the interests of the banks at the expense of encouraging leverage like cash is going out of style. This is closer to a battle between west coast elites and east coast elites than it is about the people versus the elites.

Re: Libra, 2 Weeks In

#14

Post by brighter2morrow » Tue, Jul 09, 2019, 12:57 AM UTC

r32a_ wrote: post #10

conanbatt wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a non-Us national, I prefer FB corporatism to US democracy. Puts more people on even ground.

Or choose Bitcoin and have neither :)

Choose a third position? Go ahead, throw your vote away!

Re: Libra, 2 Weeks In

#15

Post by gowld » Tue, Jul 09, 2019, 1:00 AM UTC

r32a_ wrote: post #6

Let's call this for what it really is, they want to replace democracy with Corporatism. At least with a government backed currency we get a choice on who runs the government. Even though that power is constantly being eroded. The companies that run Libra however have 0 obligation to users of Libra but only to maximise profits for their shareholders. This is their plan: * Dedicate a lot of resources to spread the adop…

What does Libra do to people who don't opt to use it?

Re: Libra, 2 Weeks In

#16

Post by whateveracct » Tue, Jul 09, 2019, 1:01 AM UTC

gowld wrote: post #15

r32a_ wrote: post #6

Let's call this for what it really is, they want to replace democracy with Corporatism. At least with a government backed currency we get a choice on who runs the government. Even though that power is constantly being eroded. The companies that run Libra however have 0 obligation to users of Libra but only to maximise profits for their shareholders. This is their plan: * Dedicate a lot of resources to spread the adop…

What does Libra do to people who don't opt to use it?

Assuming adoption - It exists in the world and has all the influence an adopted currency has. Influence controlled by Facebook.

Re: Libra, 2 Weeks In

#17

Post by sidlls » Tue, Jul 09, 2019, 1:03 AM UTC

whatshisface wrote: post #13

mromanuk wrote: post #9

Call me pessimist, but cartelized private global corporations owning and “printing” money can only bring bad things. It is centralized and is controlled by an elite.

The Fed isn't? It has more private board members than appointed board members, and some have argued that it has consistently prioritized the interests of the banks at the expense of encouraging leverage like cash is going out of style. This is closer to a battle between west coast elites and east coast elites than it is about the people versus the elites.

Well, The Fed is a bit different. It's not exactly a private corporation that is not beholden to the voting public.

More importantly, though, is your note about who this battle is between: it's a battle between groups of people who should both be viewed very skeptically when it comes to the interests of "the rest of us".

Corporate controlled money has been tried in the past; it didn't end well for workers.

Re: Libra, 2 Weeks In

#18

Post by dragonwriter » Tue, Jul 09, 2019, 1:04 AM UTC

whatshisface wrote: post #13

mromanuk wrote: post #9

Call me pessimist, but cartelized private global corporations owning and “printing” money can only bring bad things. It is centralized and is controlled by an elite.

The Fed isn't? It has more private board members than appointed board members, and some have argued that it has consistently prioritized the interests of the banks at the expense of encouraging leverage like cash is going out of style. This is closer to a battle between west coast elites and east coast elites than it is about the people versus the elites.

> It has more private board members than appointed board members

Only in the world where 0 > 7; there are 7 members of the Board of Governors, all Senate-confirmed Presidential appointees.

Re: Libra, 2 Weeks In

#19

Post by skybrian » Tue, Jul 09, 2019, 1:05 AM UTC

r32a_ wrote: post #6

Let's call this for what it really is, they want to replace democracy with Corporatism. At least with a government backed currency we get a choice on who runs the government. Even though that power is constantly being eroded. The companies that run Libra however have 0 obligation to users of Libra but only to maximise profits for their shareholders. This is their plan: * Dedicate a lot of resources to spread the adop…

Could you explain why you think democracy is important and has much to do with how U.S. currency is managed? It seems to me that voters have very little influence on decisions made by the Federal Reserve, and that's intentional. We wouldn't want a central bank to be much influenced by the latest election.

The Federal Reserve is a consortium of banks and tends to make decisions that are good for banks, so if you're worried about corporatism, it's already here.

Re: Libra, 2 Weeks In

#20

Post by politician » Tue, Jul 09, 2019, 1:08 AM UTC

diab0lic wrote: post #12

r32a_ wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wrong. Bitcoin will use Lightning Network for most everyday transactions and it's speed is only limited by network liquidity and bandwidth

Genuinely curious: Does the lightning network provide all of the same guarantees that the standard Bitcoin network provides? What are the downsides? Why isn't the lightning network used all the time instead of the Bitcoin protocol?

Lightning is new, so that's part of the adoption story. It suffers from a centralization risk similar to banks (viz a viz using a well-connected intermediary via a wide channel to transmit to arbitrary addresses off chain with less pain that establishing a dedicated channel directly).