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FBI, ICE using state driver’s license photos for facial-recognition searches

washingtonpost.com

11–20 of 128 posts

Re: FBI, ICE using state driver’s license photos for facial-recognition searches

#11

I don't know too much about facial recognition technology (I work more in the ALPR space), but I know enough to tell you that a single photo is not enough to train the software to do anything useful. Either they were sold a dream by a company making bogus claims, or they just don't give a shit about false postives in the slightest and they use it as justification to randomly stop and search people. There was an artic…

I would say that false positives are a feature. Like you mentioned it gives authorities cause to atop/investigate you. If they are wrong they have deniability. If they are right then mission accomplished!

Re: FBI, ICE using state driver’s license photos for facial-recognition searches

#12

I don't know too much about facial recognition technology (I work more in the ALPR space), but I know enough to tell you that a single photo is not enough to train the software to do anything useful. Either they were sold a dream by a company making bogus claims, or they just don't give a shit about false postives in the slightest and they use it as justification to randomly stop and search people. There was an artic…

If I had to guess, they're paying a company tons of money for a crappy product that will make us all a bit less free, and will decrease the signal to noise ratio in actual investigation of wrongdoing.

I'd also bet that there will be racial bias of one sort or another baked in, since the criminal justice system is heavily biased. Outcomes like "arrests" or "convictions" are poor proxies for crime, but good proxies for being brown or poor.

As a side note, that's one of the things that I'm excited about with the use of genetic data from ancestry type sites: they're catching white male offenders who weren't in the existing (racist) databases.

Re: FBI, ICE using state driver’s license photos for facial-recognition searches

#13

I don't know too much about facial recognition technology (I work more in the ALPR space), but I know enough to tell you that a single photo is not enough to train the software to do anything useful. Either they were sold a dream by a company making bogus claims, or they just don't give a shit about false postives in the slightest and they use it as justification to randomly stop and search people. There was an artic…

I would say that false positives are a feature. Like you mentioned it gives authorities cause to atop/investigate you. If they are wrong they have deniability. If they are right then mission accomplished!

Ouch, a punch right in the fourth ammendment.

Re: FBI, ICE using state driver’s license photos for facial-recognition searches

#14

I don't know too much about facial recognition technology (I work more in the ALPR space), but I know enough to tell you that a single photo is not enough to train the software to do anything useful. Either they were sold a dream by a company making bogus claims, or they just don't give a shit about false postives in the slightest and they use it as justification to randomly stop and search people. There was an artic…

> Either they were sold a dream by a company making bogus claims, or they just don't give a shit about false postives in the slightest and they use it as justification to randomly stop and search people.

Oh you know its both

Re: FBI, ICE using state driver’s license photos for facial-recognition searches

#15
This line caught my attention:

> The FBI said its system is 86 percent accurate at finding the right person if a search is able to generate a list of 50 possible matches, according to the GAO. But the FBI has not tested its system’s accuracy under conditions that are closer to normal, such as when a facial search returns only a few possible matches.

What the GAO study[1] actually said:

> However, we found that the tests were limited because they did not include all possible candidate list sizes and did not specify how often incorrect matches were returned. ... The FBI’s detection rate requirement for face recognition searches at the time stated that when the person exists in the database, NGI-IPS shall return a match of this person at least 85 percent of the time. However, we found that the FBI only tested this requirement with a candidate list of 50 potential matches. In these tests, 86 percent of the time, a match to a person in the database was correctly returned. The FBI had not assessed accuracy when users requested a list of 2 to 49 matches.

According to FBI, a smaller list would likely lower the accuracy of the searches as the smaller list may not contain the likely match that would be present in the larger list.

In other words, their acceptance test procedure was gamed from the beginning.

[1] https://www.gao.gov/assets/700/699489.pdf

Re: FBI, ICE using state driver’s license photos for facial-recognition searches

#16

Hmm, almost like those REAL IDs weren't such a good idea... not like civil liberties advocates mentioned this or anything... The ID security improvements (central issuance, anti-copying features) were fine and good, the federal database is not.

Why? This is a feature, not a bug. It’s working exactly as intended.

Re: FBI, ICE using state driver’s license photos for facial-recognition searches

#17

I don't know too much about facial recognition technology (I work more in the ALPR space), but I know enough to tell you that a single photo is not enough to train the software to do anything useful. Either they were sold a dream by a company making bogus claims, or they just don't give a shit about false postives in the slightest and they use it as justification to randomly stop and search people. There was an artic…

I would say that false positives are a feature. Like you mentioned it gives authorities cause to atop/investigate you. If they are wrong they have deniability. If they are right then mission accomplished!

Yah, one only needs to use drug dogs as an example here. It is a known fact the dog can be triggered to claim a hit etc... and somehow in most states a dog doing "something" is sufficient justification to have your vehicle searched..

Re: FBI, ICE using state driver’s license photos for facial-recognition searches

#18

I don't know too much about facial recognition technology (I work more in the ALPR space), but I know enough to tell you that a single photo is not enough to train the software to do anything useful. Either they were sold a dream by a company making bogus claims, or they just don't give a shit about false postives in the slightest and they use it as justification to randomly stop and search people. There was an artic…

[deleted]

Re: FBI, ICE using state driver’s license photos for facial-recognition searches

#19
Sensible regulations around what the government can do/not do in regards to things like facial recognition tech seems like it’s becoming more and more necessary. I am far more worried about privacy invasions/abuse by the government than I am by private companies that seem to get all the press (ie facebook). For the simple reason that 1) facebook can’t arrest me 2) facebook has no incentive other than targeting me with ads 3) facebook is actually incentivized to keep this data to themselves now that future competitors will not be able to Hoover up as much data as facebook did.

On the other hand, governments with the power to mass surveil their citizens has proven to be a horrible idea.

Given the choice, I’ll take the lesser of two evils which is a company that is interested in knowing the things I buy and where I go, for the express purpose of selling better ads. But all the press goes to “let’s break up big tech”. I’d be much more interested in stopping the mass surveillance of citizens by an entity that has the power to kill, imprison, subjugate and arrest, rather than an entity that has the power to target me with ads.

Re: FBI, ICE using state driver’s license photos for facial-recognition searches

#20

Yay! More surveillance! Maybe we'll finally stop getting attacked by terrorists every single day!

This might be of interest for you then, for stats on what people actually suffer from: https://twitter.com/billgates/status/1138520780042465280
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