201–210 of 518 posts
I seek to be enlightened, not to flame: what exactly is so wrong with X that it can be retrofit to work better? Wayland is taking a while, which is expected sure, but for now, X works fine although with issues.
Modern X is a Frankensteinian collection fixes upon fixes and unmaintained code.
I can't say it any better than JWZ did over 15 years ago. This is the result of the Cascade of Attention-Deficit Teenagers model and is why Linux will not approach Windows or OSX in usability. Cannot link to his site: JWZ dot org /doc/cadt.html A complete teardown and rebuild of the whole ecosystem (because X succccckkks) is fun! Making something backwards-compatible, or standardized, or polished that "last 90%" so i…
It's time for something new. This isn't attention-deficit developers at play. People have spent a lot of time on the Wayland ecosystem. This isn't just some kids hacking away in their basements ignorant of better development practices.
You argument holds up for many Linux components, but not for X/Wayland. It's preposterous to take the stance that no component in the entire Linux ecosystem ever needs to be replaced.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
HiDPI. It's somewhat unusual for a top end laptop to have 1920x1080 screens these days, and Wayland doesn't support 4k very well. You can upscale, but it looks like garbage, or it has a 2x mode, which draws image and such slightly too large, or you can deal with everything being tiny. For gaming, the latency is bad and always on vsync is horrible. They've fixed the 60Hz lock though, fortunately. This only applies to…
A lot of what you're saying seems due to a particular Wayland compositor, not to Wayland.
This is especially true for people that prefer low latency over tear-free rendering.
"for simple things using the compositor's screen shot tool is fine. But what if I don't like the screenshot tool for my compositor of choice? My experience with the GNOME screenshot tool (granted this was pre-wayland) was that it wasn't as good as, say, shutter, which has a lot of options, let's you easily crop and edit the screenshot from inside the screenshot tool etc. And then swaygrab doesn't even (currently) have an option to capture a rectangular region."
There are some other things this article mentions which are important to me, like Wayland's lack of color picker tools and xdotool functionality.
Wayland seems just way too immature for me to use for now. X works great, does everything I want, and I see no compelling reason to switch.
[1] - https://old.reddit.com/r/wayland/comments/85q78y/why_im_not_...
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Every GPU vendor but Nvidia supports these APIs. > About a year ago Nvidia announced “Wayland support” for their proprietary driver. This included KMS and DRM support (years late, I might add), but not GBM support. They shipped something called EGLStreams instead, a concept that had been discussed and shot down by the Linux graphics development community before. That’s pretty damning for Nvidia. I can see why the d…
The ideal Linux laptop is one with just Intel integrated, and no discrete GPU. Honestly, Intel GPUs are decent enough, even if you want to do some mild gaming. Handing two GPUs on a laptop in Linux doesn't have the best support. A lot of the Optimus/Bumblebee stuff is not very well maintained.
Sadly my work uses all Macbrook Pros, which are amazing machines), but I'm scared to install Archlinux on them. The Archlinux Macbook wiki pages are 4yrs+ old.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
NVIDIA doesn't support GBM, which is the standard for buffer allocation. Use nouveau. >The last issue could be solved with a reusable library that provided basic compositor functionality for window managers. This is pretty much what wlroots is.
> NVIDIA doesn't support GBM If Nvidia don't support it, how much of a useful standard can it really be?
(In principle GBM isn't quite a single-implementation Mesa only standard - third party implementations are possible, though the only one that exists right now is by ARM for their newer Mali GPUs. People seem to have had mixed results with it and I'm not sure it's even intended to run desktop Wayland.)
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> But like runit it relies on bash scripts, which are not declarative and open to a wide variety in quality, just like with sysvinit. In theory, this makes sense, with potential issues of poorly written shell scripts. In practice (I assume arising from its increasingly baroque growing complexity) systemd ends up with stability issues which aren't pleasant from an end-user perspective. Setting shutdown aside, I had a…
> On one boot I had an issue in init.el which caused emacs initialisation to hang, so the root cause wasn't systemd. But systemd didn't fail gracefully (or informatively) in this case. And it took me a while to figure out why systemd wouldn't bring up any services, since it wasn't reporting to me that the emacs service (or any service) had failed If it’s hanging it hasn’t failed. If that daemon is configured as a blo…
Is there something more that should be added to these sorts of unit definitions to improve graceful failure scenarios in systemd?
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> NVIDIA doesn't support GBM If Nvidia don't support it, how much of a useful standard can it really be?
It's an nvidia problem, not a standard problem.
I'm really not very sad to see X go. It was old, creaky and insecure. As advanced and cool as it may have been at one time, and as much as I respect the people who worked on it, it's time for it to go. As for the people complaining about Wayland possibly missing some of X's features, remember that it takes time for something to mature, to accrete features and fixes, and Wayland hasn't had that time yet. If we give it…
It has been a decade, precisely how long does it need to catch up? I ask because from what I can tell it is still missing features that were standard in Windows Vista in 2008, when that OS switched to DWM and WDDM.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Where do we even begin? Windows managers? Consistent window decorations? Thousands of applications? Consistent performance? Redshift? Global keybindings?
> Windows managers? Sway/wlroots. > Consistent window decorations? This is up to individual compositors and toolkits. > Thousands of applications Like what? Any that rely on X specific behaviour run via XWayland. > Consistent performance Wayland in theory should be faster than X, but again, this depends on compositor. > Redshift Gnome has night-light on Wayland already. KDE I think just added it. > Global keybindings…