Amazon Seeks Permission to Launch 3k Internet Satellites • Hacker News Board

Re: Amazon Seeks Permission to Launch 3k Internet Satellites

#111

Post by usbseeker » Fri, Jul 05, 2019, 11:38 PM UTC

throw0101a wrote: post #10

At what point should we start worrying about Kessler Syndrome? > The Kessler syndrome (also called the Kessler effect,[1][2] collisional cascading or ablation cascade), proposed by the NASA scientist Donald J. Kessler in 1978, is a scenario in which the density of objects in low Earth orbit (LEO) is high enough that collisions between objects could cause a cascade in which each collision generates space debris that i…

I'm more worried about the future sudden need to stop supporting the existing internet once a few companies decide we should just use their new space internet, that seemsnlike the more profitable longterm play.

Re: Amazon Seeks Permission to Launch 3k Internet Satellites

#112

Post by eloff » Fri, Jul 05, 2019, 11:42 PM UTC

wmf wrote: post #107

eloff wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because HFT firms can pay for a standard StarLink and get the same results. There are few HFT customers and you have to offer them something that can't get from your consumer service if you want them to pay commensurate to the value provided. Your other points have nothing to do with my HFT specific comment.

It's very likely that standard Starlink plans will downlink traffic as close to the customer as possible to reduce lateral utilization, but HFT needs to route traffic on the constellation all the way across the Atlantic.

It will have to be something like this that gives best possible latency for a higher price.

Re: Amazon Seeks Permission to Launch 3k Internet Satellites

#113

Post by the_pwner224 » Fri, Jul 05, 2019, 11:43 PM UTC

myaccount80 wrote: post #109

harryh wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"just for some stupid trading" is one of the underlying forces beneath the success of all modern economies. Without it almost everything you buy would be more expensive.

Are you considering “having cheaper stuff” actually progress in terms of humanity ?

Yes, when everything becomes cheaper we can pursue greater technology. Having a 5GHz computer would have been impossible some decades ago; now they can be used for scientific research by anyone who has $500.

Ultimately price is just a measurement of how many resources it takes to make something, with the currency added in as the medium of exchange. A product being cheap means it is now easy for us to make; the previous price of the now-cheap product will be taken up by a better product.

Re: Amazon Seeks Permission to Launch 3k Internet Satellites

#114

Post by ancientworldnow » Fri, Jul 05, 2019, 11:46 PM UTC

BurningFrog wrote: post #97

strikelaserclaw wrote: post #9

Anyone wanna offer me their hypothesis on what Amazon and other tech companies gain from offering internet to people who probably aren't valuable consumers?

Won't this offer internet to everyone on Earth ?

For those who can afford to spend hundreds of dollars on a receiving, sure.

(starlink, for example, will require a pizza box sized dish at what they hope will be a price of a few hundred dollars)

Re: Amazon Seeks Permission to Launch 3k Internet Satellites

#115

Post by ancientworldnow » Fri, Jul 05, 2019, 11:47 PM UTC

michaelt wrote: post #44

jandrewrogers wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Satellites are outside the regulatory authority of countries they operate over. They can do far more of value than merely provide Internet access to poor people.

Are you imagining they'll provide uncensored internet in China or something? I agree it's mechanically possible, but Amazon isn't the company I'd have expected to do it.

It's also dependent on consumers being able to purchase the receiving dish, hide its installation, and the government not to jam the signals. That's a lot of ifs.

Re: Amazon Seeks Permission to Launch 3k Internet Satellites

#116

Post by Nican » Fri, Jul 05, 2019, 11:48 PM UTC

strikelaserclaw wrote: post #9

Anyone wanna offer me their hypothesis on what Amazon and other tech companies gain from offering internet to people who probably aren't valuable consumers?

Real engineering made a video on it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=giQ8xEWjnBs

I recommend watching. The channel does really good explanations.

Re: Amazon Seeks Permission to Launch 3k Internet Satellites

#117

Post by ancientworldnow » Fri, Jul 05, 2019, 11:50 PM UTC

thefourthchime wrote: post #79

Who else thinks these systems deliver wireless high speed Internet faster than 5G?

These satellite networks require dishes (with starlink for example they're trying to get down to something pizza box sized). It's a different market than 5G and wireless carrier options. You're not going to have satellite data smartphones with these systems as they're currently planned out. They could, however, be used as backbones for cell stations, but then you're back to square one.

Re: Amazon Seeks Permission to Launch 3k Internet Satellites

#118

Post by gpm » Fri, Jul 05, 2019, 11:52 PM UTC

H8crilA wrote: post #94

gpm wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not valuable? Ships, oil rigs, airplanes, remote vacation destinations (e.g. ski lodges), etc have lots of money and a good concentration of rich people with lots of money.

Yeah and there's already a lot of providers of satellite internet. But, Starlink has not published their pricing, so it's unclear how much of the market will they capture.

Sure, there are competitors. Starlink (or any other proposed LEO constellation) offers a fundamentally better product as a result of low latency (ballpark 640ms vs 20ms). Which they get as a result of being in low earth orbit instead of geosynchronous orbit. Starlinks costs per unit bandwidth are almost certainly far lower, meaning the ability to out compete on price.

I don't see the existing constellations remaining competitive for long.

Re: Amazon Seeks Permission to Launch 3k Internet Satellites

#119

Post by greglindahl » Fri, Jul 05, 2019, 11:54 PM UTC

chiph wrote: post #105

Iridium has global coverage (you can make phone calls from the South Pole) but isn't LEO so there's a latency issue. Starlink is LEO and will have faster rates & lower latency, but won't have global coverage since the orbits don't go over the poles (sorry, Amundsen-Scott!). What about the proposed Amazon (Blue Origin?) system?

The FCC requires that Starlink cover Alaska, and it will with a later set of satellites in polar orbit.

Ditto for every constellation approved by the FCC.

Re: Amazon Seeks Permission to Launch 3k Internet Satellites

#120

Post by greglindahl » Fri, Jul 05, 2019, 11:56 PM UTC

thinkling wrote: post #108

strikelaserclaw wrote: post #9

Anyone wanna offer me their hypothesis on what Amazon and other tech companies gain from offering internet to people who probably aren't valuable consumers?

Once they have their own satellite-based cell network, they can take another stab at launching a mobile phone. The Amazon Fire2 phone will be able to use this proprietary network. Amazon could then go for entry into mobile markets by selling phones with data service included free, trying to become a third major mobile platform. Alternately, Amazon is developing their Alexa-fronted Internet-of-Things (home automation,…

Imagine how many customers will jump at the chance to carry a pizza box-sized antenna for a cellphone!