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Toyota testing improved solar roof for EVs that can charge while driving

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Re: Toyota testing improved solar roof for EVs that can charge while driving

#31

Triple junction GaAs based panels for a whole 860 watts of power in full sun at the right angle, no mention of cost. Anybody know how much a panel like that goes for per watt now days?

I've never seen triple junction GaAs raw cells sell for less than $6/watt stc rating.

For comparison I can buy pallet loads of 72 cell, 370W panels built from high efficiency mono Si cells for under $0.55/watt stc.

Re: Toyota testing improved solar roof for EVs that can charge while driving

#32
post #10

I'll start thinking Toyota is serious about EVs when it actually starts saying so -- only recently it said the future are hybrids . Yeah, right. Good luck with the bankruptcy/firesale in 10 years Toyota!

Hybrids are the future for most of the market worldwide. It will take decades to build out the charging infrastructure necessary to support battery electric vehicles. Some industrialized countries will move faster.

Re: Toyota testing improved solar roof for EVs that can charge while driving

#33

I live in a pretty hot city (My car's outside thermometer showed 48°C yesterday at midday). The extended range is nice and all, but if somebody makes a car that can run the AC without running/draining the battery while it's parked, even if it's just a little to keep the car interior at 35°C or so, I would, without exaggeration, buy it the day it's released here. Hell, I'd consider it even if it would just keep the fa…

how much power does an AC use (say on medium settings) ?

Wikipedia says 3kW https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automobile_air_conditioning#Po...

It also says that the most efficient photovoltaics yield 175W per square meter. (Though I've seen figures as high as 200W.) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_panel#Efficiencies

Re: Toyota testing improved solar roof for EVs that can charge while driving

#34
post #10

I'll start thinking Toyota is serious about EVs when it actually starts saying so -- only recently it said the future are hybrids . Yeah, right. Good luck with the bankruptcy/firesale in 10 years Toyota!

Yes, a company that will have a $23B profit in FY2019 will be out of business in 10 years.

I'm sure if they really want to get serious about EV's they can find a scrappy little startup to acquire. I hear there's at least one that could use their production expertise that is struggling each quarter to turn a profit.

Re: Toyota testing improved solar roof for EVs that can charge while driving

#36

They covered the car, including the back window, in triple-junction solar cells. Last I heard, those were made of expensive stuff like indium gallium arsenide junctions. They were popular on satellites because they do really really well outside of atmosphere and much worse in shaded and indirect light conditions than silicon. I'd like to know how much those cells really cost and how much power is left when you can se…

I will literally believe somebody has successfully commercialized triple junction GaAs cells, when I can pull out my Visa card and order a pallet of 20 assembled modules from a distributor. As I can do now for 54, 60 and 72 cell panels built from high quality 156mm monocrystalline Si cells.

Until then I think triple junction GaAs is going to see the most use in experimental UAVs funded by research money, and satellites.

Re: Toyota testing improved solar roof for EVs that can charge while driving

#37

I live in a pretty hot city (My car's outside thermometer showed 48°C yesterday at midday). The extended range is nice and all, but if somebody makes a car that can run the AC without running/draining the battery while it's parked, even if it's just a little to keep the car interior at 35°C or so, I would, without exaggeration, buy it the day it's released here. Hell, I'd consider it even if it would just keep the fa…

how much power does an AC use (say on medium settings) ?

This probably isn't the most reliable source, but the infotainment screen on my VW estimates the hourly gas consumption for the climate system.

Running on Max A/C, the screen reads just under 1/8 gal/hr. With the A/C on and with the fans at 50%, consumption is a little less but still around 1/8 gal/hr. Consumption drops too low to get a reading when A/C is off with fans 50%.

Re: Toyota testing improved solar roof for EVs that can charge while driving

#38

I live in a pretty hot city (My car's outside thermometer showed 48°C yesterday at midday). The extended range is nice and all, but if somebody makes a car that can run the AC without running/draining the battery while it's parked, even if it's just a little to keep the car interior at 35°C or so, I would, without exaggeration, buy it the day it's released here. Hell, I'd consider it even if it would just keep the fa…

> I would ... buy it the day it’s released

Sounds like this “dog mode” does exactly what you’re wanting. I see a new Tesla in your future :)

Re: Toyota testing improved solar roof for EVs that can charge while driving

#39

I live in a pretty hot city (My car's outside thermometer showed 48°C yesterday at midday). The extended range is nice and all, but if somebody makes a car that can run the AC without running/draining the battery while it's parked, even if it's just a little to keep the car interior at 35°C or so, I would, without exaggeration, buy it the day it's released here. Hell, I'd consider it even if it would just keep the fa…

how much power does an AC use (say on medium settings) ?

Window units range from 700 W to 2+ kW. The Model 3 has a pretty powerful one, at least 1 kW. That's peak draw, and it'll turn on and off intermittently[1]. Average draw should work out to 200-300 watts for medium.

[1]: Like a fridge. Refrigeration systems are most efficient at full power. IIRC it's due to the restrictor plate separating the hot and cold radiators- it's designed to work at a certain rate of flow, so you'll get gas and liquid mixing at lower power.

Re: Toyota testing improved solar roof for EVs that can charge while driving

#40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how much power does an AC use (say on medium settings) ?

Wikipedia says 3kW https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automobile_air_conditioning#Po... It also says that the most efficient photovoltaics yield 175W per square meter. (Though I've seen figures as high as 200W.) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_panel#Efficiencies

That's for a belt-driven A/C, tied directly to the engine RPM. They're inherently much less efficient because they have to work over a wide range of speeds. A motor-driven A/C will be 1-2 kW.

That's also the peak power, and a motorized A/C will instead be turned on and off leading to a much lower power draw that also depends less on the peak power. Typically a 50-30% duty cycle, so 200-300 watts very roughly. More depending on the insulation, sun, and outside temperature.

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