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Kuo: Apple to include new scissor switch keyboard in MacBook

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Re: Kuo: Apple to include new scissor switch keyboard in MacBook

#351

Post by dasil003 »

bmurphy1976 wrote: post #316
stickfigure wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just last week bought a pristine, maxed-out 2015 MacBook Pro. Yet I think you're wrong about most of this. * I hate magsafe. I've owned a dozen of these and almost all of them have come apart just behind the magsafe connector. Expensive, proprietary, and fragile. I would much much rather have USB-C than shell out $90 every two years. * USB-C is great. A bunch of different ports means carrying a bunch of different c…

> The new keyboard. The ergonomics are fine, but I am hard on keyboards and nevertheless expect 5+ years of duty (my last machine was bought new in 2013, and just wasn't cutting it with 8G of RAM). I can't have an unreliable and expensive keyboard. I just don't get it. I've had my MPB with the new keyboard for 9 months now and I hate it more than ever. The ergonomics are absolutely terrible, the layout (particularly…

I’m only two months in having been clinging to my 2015 MBP until recently forced to upgrade by my company. Now I feel borderline incompetent at times when I can’t hit the arrow keys or escape smoothly. One solution is to use an external keyboard, but then I won’t adapt to the new feel and I’ll be stuck like this forever, unable to type competently in a meeting or any other time I’m away from my desk.

I could probably get used to the feel of the latest butterfly keys, but the arrow keys and virtual escape key and to a lesser extent virtual F-keys are intolerable. It’s like has Jony Ive ever had to type something? Hell no, he has people to do that for him, the important thing is everything he touches look immaculate in a 90-degree closeup and framed above his mantel.

Re: Kuo: Apple to include new scissor switch keyboard in MacBook

#352

Post by ramphastidae »

zamfi wrote: post #276
ramphastidae wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't understand because you haven't shifted your mindset about Apple correctly. As a former Apple fan I was the same way. Apple under Tim Cook is motivated by shareholder value , not usability or design leadership, as they were under Steve Jobs. They got rid of Magsafe and the rest of the useful ports and added USB-C not because of the warm and fuzzy feeling it gives nerds, but because it streamlines factory pro…

> They got rid of Magsafe and the rest of the useful ports and added USB-C not because of the warm and fuzzy feeling it gives nerds, but because it streamlines factory production and makes the laptop thinner. A “former apple fan” should surely remember the hand-wringing over the iMac USB switch too. And Lightning? Apple has always pushed almost-there technologies with benefits over legacy tech, this isn’t about “shar…

Sure, I remember ... The disabling of Flash and removal of CD drives, ethernet ports and headphone jacks are good examples too. I still have the dongles I bought for my Powerbook.

But up until now it hasn't been a unilateral replacement of all ports with just one type. The dongle I bought was an adapter for one port and one use-case. I didn't have to buy a new adapter for every peripheral I owned.

Ultimately if Apple had included a portable docking-station-like adapter that had HDMI and a few USB-not-C ports along with the laptop purchase I would be OK.

Re: Kuo: Apple to include new scissor switch keyboard in MacBook

#353

Post by WiseWeasel »

starsinspace wrote: post #297
parasubvert wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See, I use a retina MBP touchbar and really don't agree. Apple has made some missteps but it's still the best pro laptop for my uses. Over two years with one replaced keyboard (because I spilled wine on it!) and no sticking keys. USB-C is awesome. I can reuse all my 3rd party and Apple adapters for my USB-C peripherals, including tablets and the Nintendo Switch. In retrospect, Magsafe wasn't that great (comes off too…

> Moving back to older USB ports really would make no sense. They're obsolete. I sure wish I could join you in the year 2030 where USB-C is everywhere, but unfortunately I’m stuck here in 2019 and USB-A is still the de-facto standard on just about everything. It’s nice to design a product to be forward-looking and adopting standards early when it’s foreseeable that they will soon become big. Like the Mac mini 2018, w…

You can buy cheap cables with USB-C on one end, and USB-A, USB-B, Display Port, mini-DP/Thunderbolt, HDMI, Lightning, mini/micro-USB, etc. on the other end. No need to change devices, just get new cables. There are even tiny little adapters that fit on the end of your existing cables; you’ll hardly notice them.

Re: Kuo: Apple to include new scissor switch keyboard in MacBook

#354

Post by scarface74 »

ramphastidae wrote: post #251
hoorayimhelping wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get the warm and fuzzy feeling USB-C gives nerds, cause of the open standard and interoperability, and cause it only takes one attempt to actually plug it in; but I just cannot fathom how Apple replaced Magsafe with USB-C. Magsafe was one of those magical Apple features from the mid 2000s that just delight and work incredibly well and almost seem like science fiction. It's not like they had shitty power adapters an…

You don't understand because you haven't shifted your mindset about Apple correctly. As a former Apple fan I was the same way. Apple under Tim Cook is motivated by shareholder value , not usability or design leadership, as they were under Steve Jobs. They got rid of Magsafe and the rest of the useful ports and added USB-C not because of the warm and fuzzy feeling it gives nerds, but because it streamlines factory pro…

They got rid of Magsafe and the rest of the useful ports and added USB-C not because of the warm and fuzzy feeling it gives nerds, but because it streamlines factory production and makes the laptop thinner.

Except for the “make things thinner part”, there was the same complaint about the original iMac when they got rid of all of their ports and went USB all the way. The Macs before then had serial, ADB, and SCSI - and of course the floppy.

Re: Kuo: Apple to include new scissor switch keyboard in MacBook

#355

Post by [deleted] »

nottorp wrote: post #58
WAHa_06x36 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that the keyboard breaks very easily, at random.

If you're always in a clean environment, the keyboard is ok. I've used 3 consecutive mac laptops on the same balcony, open air. The one from 2010 and the one from 2014 are just fine thank you. The one from 2018 already has keyboard problems and it hasn't even been a year since i bought it. So yes, the keyboard is complete and utter shit.

[deleted]

Re: Kuo: Apple to include new scissor switch keyboard in MacBook

#356

Post by hombre_fatal »

shawkinaw wrote: post #303

Am I the only person who likes the butterfly keyboard? I like the feel of the low travel and the clickiness, whenever I use an old style MacBook the keys feel mushy. I have had reliability problems though. Mostly I’ve had keys that don’t respond, but have always been able to fix those with compressed air. But once I had a sticky key that popped every other time I pressed it, that required a free Apple repair.

The problem is how fast they wear and fail. Especially if you're not dainty on the keyboard.

Also, they lose their clickiness rapidly.

It would be a great keyboard if you got a new one every month. But I expect mine to last the full life of the laptop just like my 2015 Air did.

Re: Kuo: Apple to include new scissor switch keyboard in MacBook

#357

Post by Reason077 »

labcomputer wrote: post #262
parasubvert wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I found the Magsafe adapter cords would fray, corrode, and blacken pretty easily, becoming a fire hazard. Every Macbook I owned, I would need at least one replacement over a 3 year period. The amount of time taken to re-plugin it in vs. times it saved my laptop from flying, really it was an overrated feature. USB-C comes out easily enough. Don't get me wrong, I liked Magsafe. But I don't understand the passion for it…

> I found the Magsafe adapter cords would fray, corrode, and blacken pretty easily, becoming a fire hazard. Why do you attribute fraying and/or blackening of the cable to the connector at the end?

> "Why do you attribute fraying and/or blackening of the cable to the connector at the end?"

It was at the point where the cable meets the connector that the fraying problem occurred. I suspect that because of the nature of MagSafe, many people tended to pull on the cable to remove it rather than actually grip the connector, which contributed to the problem.

But the real flaw with MagSafe (other than it being proprietary) was that the cable was permanently attached to the power brick. At least with USB-C, if the cable fails, you can just replace the cable - not the entire power supply!

Re: Kuo: Apple to include new scissor switch keyboard in MacBook

#358

Post by keldaris »

stickfigure wrote: post #305
aleem wrote: post #188

Apple has squandered a lot of its goodwill. It reminds me of my relationship with Microsoft products. As long as they were shipping, they were making money in the short term because people were coerced to buy in. For 5 damn years the Air didn't get a Retina display. Right now, I can't buy 2.8Ghz Macbook Pro unless I get the TouchBar. I can't buy an Air unless I settle for much lower specs. The dongles and USB-C are a…

I just last week bought a pristine, maxed-out 2015 MacBook Pro. Yet I think you're wrong about most of this. * I hate magsafe. I've owned a dozen of these and almost all of them have come apart just behind the magsafe connector. Expensive, proprietary, and fragile. I would much much rather have USB-C than shell out $90 every two years. * USB-C is great. A bunch of different ports means carrying a bunch of different c…

> I don't want a sexy svelte fragile expensive luxury status symbol. I want a rugged capital good that will reliably allow me to work for the next half-decade.

Then why are you looking at Apple products at all? You're looking for a ThinkPad or an EliteBook. Fragile expensive luxury status symbols are exactly what Apple makes and always has ever since Jobs. Now they're just more blatant about it.

Re: Kuo: Apple to include new scissor switch keyboard in MacBook

#359

Post by parasubvert »

porker wrote: post #313
parasubvert wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I found the Magsafe adapter cords would fray, corrode, and blacken pretty easily, becoming a fire hazard. Every Macbook I owned, I would need at least one replacement over a 3 year period. The amount of time taken to re-plugin it in vs. times it saved my laptop from flying, really it was an overrated feature. USB-C comes out easily enough. Don't get me wrong, I liked Magsafe. But I don't understand the passion for it…

> I found the Magsafe adapter cords would fray, corrode, and blacken pretty easily, becoming a fire hazard. Every Macbook I owned, I would need at least one replacement over a 3 year period. My Magsafe power supply is a decade old, and except for being dirty has no problems. You've repeated it a couple of times in this thread, and this doesn't hold up. 1. The cord is standard plastic sheathing: how does that fray? 2.…

1. See sibling posters. The plastic sheathing would split, and eventually splay. Electrical tape was the solution many used.

2. North America?

3. Burnt, i.e. the cable would turn brown at the edges connecting to the power supply or the Magsafe adapter.

I'm glad your power supply still works. This situation is sort of like the new MBP Keyboard: I've never had a problem with it, but many have. With the older power supplies, I've gone through at least three replacements over 10 years of MagSafe, not counting the new ones I received with new laptops. Much less expensive and time consuming than the keyboard so not as big a deal.

My point is that the Magsafe power adapters weren't this shining beacon of perfect design. They had flaws in practice, and USB-C has so far corrected those flaws (and introduced its own tradeoffs).

Re: Kuo: Apple to include new scissor switch keyboard in MacBook

#360

Post by welly »

starsinspace wrote: post #332
welly wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can get USB-C monitors, external hard drives, most modern phones connect via USB-C. What else do you need? Bluetooth fills in the gaps for things like external keyboards and mice and most modern printers can be connected to via wifi. I appreciate my needs/requirements are not everyones but USB-C isn't exactly elusive these days.

Sure, if I throw away all the USB-A things I have and start over now... but that would be quite a waste. Also, try to find a true USB-C hub. With that I mean a box with one upstream USB-C input and several (>= 3) USB-C downstream ports. As far as I can tell, such products still do not exist. There are many USB-C-docks with USB-C input, various other downstream ports, and sometimes an additional USB-C port which is po…

Do you still hang onto that old VCR because DVD players won't play your tapes and it'd be a waste to throw that VCR away?

At some point we have to upgrade if we want to stay current. This is the same with any technology, not just USB-C.

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