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The Backbone of VHF Amateur Radio May Be Under Threat

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Re: The Backbone of VHF Amateur Radio May Be Under Threat

#41

Post by hanoz »

kylehotchkiss wrote: post #19

I can't help but feel the amateur radio community could have used a rebrand for the internet age. I understand there's a lot of history but it's hard to get young people interested in being _hams_, a word that has not aged well. I got my licence about a decade back and really loved the technical pieces - learning about how radio waves worked, propagation with different bands, the ability to (try) to build your own mo…

In my opinion one of the best ways of injecting some new life into the community would be to let people take their test online.

Re: The Backbone of VHF Amateur Radio May Be Under Threat

#42

Post by throwayEngineer »

kylehotchkiss wrote: post #19

I can't help but feel the amateur radio community could have used a rebrand for the internet age. I understand there's a lot of history but it's hard to get young people interested in being _hams_, a word that has not aged well. I got my licence about a decade back and really loved the technical pieces - learning about how radio waves worked, propagation with different bands, the ability to (try) to build your own mo…

Where do you not have cellular reception? Even our secret vacation spot has 4g now.

I understand that without cellular, there is value, but is there any value with internet?

Re: The Backbone of VHF Amateur Radio May Be Under Threat

#43

Post by jpmattia »

Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #30
kylehotchkiss wrote: post #19

I can't help but feel the amateur radio community could have used a rebrand for the internet age. I understand there's a lot of history but it's hard to get young people interested in being _hams_, a word that has not aged well. I got my licence about a decade back and really loved the technical pieces - learning about how radio waves worked, propagation with different bands, the ability to (try) to build your own mo…

> other people just wanted to talk about radios. I felt the same disappointment when I got into amateur radio just before the modern internet took off. I loved the idea of talking with people around the world and maybe even practicing some foreign languages, so I immediately set up a station for DXing. All those people from exotic foreign countries just wanted to make a few quick remarks about their radios. No one wa…

> But to be fair, the wording of amateur radio regulations in many countries suggests that hams should not try to have substantial conversations over the airwaves.

But it's worth noting: A lot of that verbiage dates from the Cold War, and is rooted in the spy communications culture that leftover from WW2. It's pretty doubtful that any intelligence service gives a damn about what goes over the air these days. In fact, it would be a bonus for your adversary's old-fashioned "listening posts", because they could "intercept" the broadcast.

So an ITU update to what is allowed to go out over the air would also be sensible.

Edit: Although you just know encrypted packets would be forbidden, despite the fact that we can easily send encrypted packets via the internet, which requires a great deal more work to "intercept".

Re: The Backbone of VHF Amateur Radio May Be Under Threat

#44

Post by WA9ACE »

hanoz wrote: post #41
kylehotchkiss wrote: post #19

I can't help but feel the amateur radio community could have used a rebrand for the internet age. I understand there's a lot of history but it's hard to get young people interested in being _hams_, a word that has not aged well. I got my licence about a decade back and really loved the technical pieces - learning about how radio waves worked, propagation with different bands, the ability to (try) to build your own mo…

In my opinion one of the best ways of injecting some new life into the community would be to let people take their test online.

Agreed, going to take a proctored test is such a huge barrier to entry.

Re: The Backbone of VHF Amateur Radio May Be Under Threat

#45

Post by madengr »

quotemstr wrote: post #15

Unpopular opinion time: spectrum is a limited resource. We shouldn't waste it on efficient analog technologies like conventional commercial and amateur radio. We've already ceased conventional broadcasts: that's a step in the right direction, but there's more to do. The entire RF spectrum should be devoted to LTE-like efficient, packetized, and secure communication. I'd make small exceptions for things like radio ast…

No it shouldn’t. It’s amateur radio, and an amateur should not have to develop an OFDM modem with LDPC coding, just to experiment. They should be able to cobble together a single tube radio and have fun, while learning something. You don’t want to turn 99.99% of amateur licensees into appliance operators.

Re: The Backbone of VHF Amateur Radio May Be Under Threat

#46

Post by Stratoscope »

Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #30
kylehotchkiss wrote: post #19

I can't help but feel the amateur radio community could have used a rebrand for the internet age. I understand there's a lot of history but it's hard to get young people interested in being _hams_, a word that has not aged well. I got my licence about a decade back and really loved the technical pieces - learning about how radio waves worked, propagation with different bands, the ability to (try) to build your own mo…

> other people just wanted to talk about radios. I felt the same disappointment when I got into amateur radio just before the modern internet took off. I loved the idea of talking with people around the world and maybe even practicing some foreign languages, so I immediately set up a station for DXing. All those people from exotic foreign countries just wanted to make a few quick remarks about their radios. No one wa…

What has worked well for me is to ask questions about non-controversial topics that most people are interested in. A great one is food. I've often told people in other countries (or even here in the US) that I would like to visit their area sometime, and what are some local foods I should try?

This has started some pretty interesting conversations, because who doesn't like food and talking about it? And it shows that I'm interested in their local culture.

Re: The Backbone of VHF Amateur Radio May Be Under Threat

#47

Post by madengr »

lawfulcactus wrote: post #40
madengr wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well at least with SSB and CW you have a short conversation. JT8, etc, have reduced “contacts” to a few bytes. Don’t get me wrong, pushing the Shannon capacity limit is great, but I’ll wager many stations are not even running QRP for the newer digital modes.

>JT8, etc, have reduced "contacts" to a few bytes I think you mixed up FT8 and JS8 there. :) FT8 is the (effectively) zero-interaction DX mode. JS8 exactly the opposite-- a weak signal mode based on FT8 tailored for ragchewing.

Ha ha, I guess the modes in WSJT-X. I know JT65 is one. At least with PSK31 you are typing in real-time. With JT65 it’s fully automated. Ought to only be counted as a contact when it’s below the 2.5 kHz noise bandwidth. When I can hear multiple JT65 signals in SSB audio, that’s totally cheating. Those guys are probably running +10W.

Re: The Backbone of VHF Amateur Radio May Be Under Threat

#48

Post by kawfey »

moftz wrote: post #36
throw0101a wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So I cannot imagine there is a current lack of frequencies for aviation in France (or anywhere in Europe). This isn't about voice / ATC, but rather about up/downlinks for drones and such. From the background on the proposal: > The decisions of previous conferences have introduced some restrictions to the use and have imposed constraints on the development of aeronautical mobile applications within some existing mob…

Why would you want to try to pump video over VHF? You have line of sight to everyone when you are in an airplane. Use a higher frequency band that allows for much more bandwidth and therefore higher data speeds. The little 1.2GHz video transmitters can easily reach 10km. That is cruising altitude for a commercial airliner. Having the proper license would get you even greater distance with a higher transmit power. Hav…

This, to me, is why this request is so unusual. This is much more suited for spread spectrum, secure, short wavelength (smaller antennas) and the like, and its surprising that Thales - a world renowned avionics corporation - is behind the push. It's also why I think this big 2m band scare is moot; someone didn't actually do the engineering, it's like they just threw out a random number and put it in a powerpoint slide.

Re: The Backbone of VHF Amateur Radio May Be Under Threat

#49

Post by bwigfield »

WA9ACE wrote: post #44
hanoz wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my opinion one of the best ways of injecting some new life into the community would be to let people take their test online.

Agreed, going to take a proctored test is such a huge barrier to entry.

I think I'm going to disagree with that. Because I had to take the test in person I meet the guys in the local club. Their personal invite to club meeting and lent gear got me on the air quickly. If I just took the test online I would probably have just put my license up on the wall and moved onto something else.

73's KC3SOL

Re: The Backbone of VHF Amateur Radio May Be Under Threat

#50

Post by Stratoscope »

quotemstr wrote: post #15

Unpopular opinion time: spectrum is a limited resource. We shouldn't waste it on efficient analog technologies like conventional commercial and amateur radio. We've already ceased conventional broadcasts: that's a step in the right direction, but there's more to do. The entire RF spectrum should be devoted to LTE-like efficient, packetized, and secure communication. I'd make small exceptions for things like radio ast…

I was talking with a friend the other day, a brilliant young software developer at Google, and the topic of ham radio came up. He said what really got him excited about it was the possibility of building his own transmitter from scratch, using individual components he could see and fully understand.

I think that is something to encourage even in this day of LTE.

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