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'We all suffer': why San Francisco techies hate the city they transformed

theguardian.com

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Re: 'We all suffer': why San Francisco techies hate the city they transformed

#51

Post by YorkshireSeason »

brokenkebab wrote: post #13

It's hilarious to read all these militaristic wordings about techies waging "battles", and "conquering" the city, as if it's about barbarian hordes which came down on peaceful SF, pillaged, raped, and burnt everything to the ground. Sure, why scritinize California's, or the city's political theater, why questioning law enforcement inefficiency. Can it be somehow related to drugs, prostitution, and theft? No, it's all…

Interesting variant of dehumanisation [1] that often precedes the act of taking property without compensation. The gap between the article's "the city [the tech workers] fought so hard to conquer", and the reality that is squarely the opposite (tech workers did not engage in violence at all, did not fire a single shot) is remarkable, and scarily Orwellian.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dehumanization

Re: 'We all suffer': why San Francisco techies hate the city they transformed

#52

Post by lm28469 »

skocznymroczny wrote: post #31
mschuster91 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> why not just send your kids to the schools your taxes are paying for? Because thanks to massive underfunding US public education is ... not exactly what one can expect from a first world country. In some areas children actually only have four days of school because of underfunding ( http://www.ladbible.com/news/news-school-switches-to-four-da... ).

Is that so bad? Schooling is a waste of time anyway, this way kids have more free time and they can enjoy their childhood and learn some new skills on their own.

> Schooling is a waste of time anyway > enjoy their childhood and learn some new skills on their own.

Sadly most kids wouldn't "enjoy their childhood" without school. Schools aren't just about useless assignments, it's a social framework that prepare you for life; learning, the scientific method, living/working with people you don't agree with, doing tasks you don't want to right know but which end up beneficial in the mid/long term, entering a community, &c.

You need a minimum set of tools to be able to navigate in life and most people aren't going to learn these by themselves. Some people have great families/local communities which can play this role but I doubt it's the majority.

None of that needs to happen in a $50k/yr private school though.

Re: 'We all suffer': why San Francisco techies hate the city they transformed

#53

Post by sundvor »

mcv wrote: post #27
ainiriand wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the public system sucks and the more money you have for that the more opportunities they will have.

That the school system sucks is not an unavoidable fact of life, it's a problem that needs to be fixed. I admit, another problem on the big pile of problems that need to be fixed, apparently.

It doesn't suck in countries such as Australia and Norway.

Re: 'We all suffer': why San Francisco techies hate the city they transformed

#54

Post by vasilipupkin »

majewsky wrote: post #24
mschuster91 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> why not just send your kids to the schools your taxes are paying for? Because thanks to massive underfunding US public education is ... not exactly what one can expect from a first world country. In some areas children actually only have four days of school because of underfunding ( http://www.ladbible.com/news/news-school-switches-to-four-da... ).

> US public education is ... not exactly what one can expect from a first world country. As a European, I slowly wonder if there's any public service in the US that meets the "first-world country" standard. Not education. Certainly not healthcare. Infrastructure is also crumbling from what I hear.

Plenty of places in the US have excellent public schools. This is unique to SF.

Re: 'We all suffer': why San Francisco techies hate the city they transformed

#55

Post by Angostura »

skocznymroczny wrote: post #31
mschuster91 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> why not just send your kids to the schools your taxes are paying for? Because thanks to massive underfunding US public education is ... not exactly what one can expect from a first world country. In some areas children actually only have four days of school because of underfunding ( http://www.ladbible.com/news/news-school-switches-to-four-da... ).

Is that so bad? Schooling is a waste of time anyway, this way kids have more free time and they can enjoy their childhood and learn some new skills on their own.

What makes you say schooling is a waste of time? My kids in an East London comprehensive have come out with a great, rounded knowledge set and a whole set of interests I wouldn't have been able to inculcate into them, plus some rather cool friends.

Re: 'We all suffer': why San Francisco techies hate the city they transformed

#56

Post by ttonkytonk »

majewsky wrote: post #24
mschuster91 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> why not just send your kids to the schools your taxes are paying for? Because thanks to massive underfunding US public education is ... not exactly what one can expect from a first world country. In some areas children actually only have four days of school because of underfunding ( http://www.ladbible.com/news/news-school-switches-to-four-da... ).

> US public education is ... not exactly what one can expect from a first world country. As a European, I slowly wonder if there's any public service in the US that meets the "first-world country" standard. Not education. Certainly not healthcare. Infrastructure is also crumbling from what I hear.

I think there's a fundamental distrust of government here in the U.S. that I chalked up to greed until I bothered to glance at the beginning of Tom Paine's "Common Sense" which basically states that government is a necessary evil.

Re: 'We all suffer': why San Francisco techies hate the city they transformed

#57

Post by michaelt »

skocznymroczny wrote: post #31
mschuster91 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> why not just send your kids to the schools your taxes are paying for? Because thanks to massive underfunding US public education is ... not exactly what one can expect from a first world country. In some areas children actually only have four days of school because of underfunding ( http://www.ladbible.com/news/news-school-switches-to-four-da... ).

Is that so bad? Schooling is a waste of time anyway, this way kids have more free time and they can enjoy their childhood and learn some new skills on their own.

  Is that so bad? Schooling is
  a waste of time anyway
The fact this thread is about people paying $30,000 a year for private school suggests this not a universally accepted truth.

Re: 'We all suffer': why San Francisco techies hate the city they transformed

#58

Post by rdl »

majewsky wrote: post #24
mschuster91 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> why not just send your kids to the schools your taxes are paying for? Because thanks to massive underfunding US public education is ... not exactly what one can expect from a first world country. In some areas children actually only have four days of school because of underfunding ( http://www.ladbible.com/news/news-school-switches-to-four-da... ).

> US public education is ... not exactly what one can expect from a first world country. As a European, I slowly wonder if there's any public service in the US that meets the "first-world country" standard. Not education. Certainly not healthcare. Infrastructure is also crumbling from what I hear.

Military. Fire service. Police (in specific ways). Government research. University education. Parks. Interstate highways.

Re: 'We all suffer': why San Francisco techies hate the city they transformed

#59

Post by vasilipupkin »

kieckerjan wrote: post #43

European here. My girlfriend and I are excited to do a tour of the West Coast later this year. As a tech I feel it would be silly to skip San Francisco and Silicon Valley, but I must say the stories I have been hearing have dampened my initial enthusiasm considerably. I now wonder if it is worth our while. If "avocado toast and class warfare" are the main attractions nowadays, we can probably spend our time more wise…

Most of what you are reading is basically fake news. Yes, there are homeless in SF, but overall it’s a beautiful city and it’s surroundings, check out Muir Woods

Re: 'We all suffer': why San Francisco techies hate the city they transformed

#60

Post by lmnt »

kieckerjan wrote: post #43

European here. My girlfriend and I are excited to do a tour of the West Coast later this year. As a tech I feel it would be silly to skip San Francisco and Silicon Valley, but I must say the stories I have been hearing have dampened my initial enthusiasm considerably. I now wonder if it is worth our while. If "avocado toast and class warfare" are the main attractions nowadays, we can probably spend our time more wise…

I did a similar trip last year. San Francisco can be a charming city at times, I especially recommend doing a bike tour across the golden gate bridge via the golden gate park. Alcatraz was interesting to visit too.

Just beware that it is a pretty run down and dirty city. The streets downtown are full of homeless people who seem to be not all there. I've never felt as unsafe in any city as when walking in downtown SF in the evening, it's very counterintuitive if you're used to downtown areas in Europe. Also avoid public transit at night.

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