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Microsoft's eBook Apocalypse Shows the Dark Side of DRM

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Re: Microsoft's eBook Apocalypse Shows the Dark Side of DRM

#11

Post by bad_user »

pjmlp wrote: post #6
akerro wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's more a trust issue in a technology. Pirated ebooks don't have DRM and never expire, can be opened on any device and you keep the money anyway.

Or never buy DRM books to start with. I own a Kindle, however I only buy ebooks from stores that offer epub and PDF as well. At max with watermarks.

Any recommendations for such stores?

I know of https://www.downpour.com for audio books and I get all my audio books from them since they are DRM-free.

Would love to know of such a service for ebooks, but for fiction.

Re: Microsoft's eBook Apocalypse Shows the Dark Side of DRM

#12

Post by ssivark »

nathantotten wrote: post #2

> Microsoft will refund customers in full for what they paid, plus an extra $25 if they made annotations or mark-ups. Doesn’t seem all that nefarious. Get your money back, order the paperbacks. No DRM issues again.

And what about the hours of effort put into reading, annotating, and jotting down notes on the ebook? (Typical of serious reading/research) That is worth way more than $25 -- MS is robbing people of the value they tried to create/store for their future selves. What use is a "platform" if it can't support that?

Re: Microsoft's eBook Apocalypse Shows the Dark Side of DRM

#13

Post by nyolfen »

bad_user wrote: post #11
pjmlp wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or never buy DRM books to start with. I own a Kindle, however I only buy ebooks from stores that offer epub and PDF as well. At max with watermarks.

Any recommendations for such stores? I know of https://www.downpour.com for audio books and I get all my audio books from them since they are DRM-free. Would love to know of such a service for ebooks, but for fiction.

tor is a scifi/fantasy+adjacent publisher that famously offers drm-free ebooks

https://www.tor.com/

Re: Microsoft's eBook Apocalypse Shows the Dark Side of DRM

#15

Post by ChrisLomont »

inlined wrote: post #4

1. How much cost is really involved in keeping up the DRM server in maintenance mode on Azure? 2. Maybe this will give the EFF enough case study to argue (successfully, finally) that the DMCA allows corporations to create rules that violate other existing laws such as the right of first sale.

The right sale doctrine doesn’t apply to products like these; these are licenses to use. If they were first sale doctrine products, you could sell your goods on secondary markets, which you cannot.

Re: Microsoft's eBook Apocalypse Shows the Dark Side of DRM

#17

Post by arghwhat »

ChrisLomont wrote: post #15
inlined wrote: post #4

1. How much cost is really involved in keeping up the DRM server in maintenance mode on Azure? 2. Maybe this will give the EFF enough case study to argue (successfully, finally) that the DMCA allows corporations to create rules that violate other existing laws such as the right of first sale.

The right sale doctrine doesn’t apply to products like these; these are licenses to use. If they were first sale doctrine products, you could sell your goods on secondary markets, which you cannot.

There should be some crackdown on selling licenses over products. It is abused to absurd extends.

Re: Microsoft's eBook Apocalypse Shows the Dark Side of DRM

#18

Post by brewdad »

intopieces wrote: post #8
nathantotten wrote: post #2

> Microsoft will refund customers in full for what they paid, plus an extra $25 if they made annotations or mark-ups. Doesn’t seem all that nefarious. Get your money back, order the paperbacks. No DRM issues again.

This assumes that the paperback exists. It ought to be the responsibility of the vendor to offer either a full refund or a hard copy, at the vendor's expense, including any annotations that were made on the digital copy.

While having such an option may be a good idea, one of the main appeals of ebooks for me is that I already have far too many linear feet of paper books. Giving me a hard copy adds to this problem.

Either way, let me annotate my own paper book TYVM.

Re: Microsoft's eBook Apocalypse Shows the Dark Side of DRM

#19

Post by nyreed »

I mean, honestly this was clear from the moment online stores with DRM'd media started appearing. If it's not stored on your own device in a DRM free format, it can disappear at any time.

It's less 'the dark side of DRM', and more simply that DRM requires actively maintained infrastructure. When the business case isn't there to pay for that anymore (or the company goes bust), then what else can one expect?

Re: Microsoft's eBook Apocalypse Shows the Dark Side of DRM

#20

Post by shadowoflight »

bad_user wrote: post #14

For audio books I buy only from Downpour.com because they are DRM-free. Any recommendations for a site selling DRM-FREE ebooks for fiction?

I haven’t used them personally, but there are several mentioned in the replies to this tweet about the MS eBook shutdown: https://twitter.com/rdonoghue/status/1144011630197522432?s=2
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