Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Trade War Has Damaged U.S. Chip Industry

nytimes.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

141–150 of 223 posts

Re: Trade War Has Damaged U.S. Chip Industry

#141

Post by kazagistar »

adventured wrote: post #100
olefoo wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That is balanced by the strictly superior American rule of law The rule of law is looking pretty tattered and worn in the US of A right now. What with the President committing obstruction of justice in plain view and his AG declaring that a sitting President may not be indicted for any crime. Not to mention the grotesque violations of human rights that are happening at the network of concentration camps the current…

The US is not running a network of concentration camps. A hundred thousand illegal immigrants per month are being caught crossing into the US through the southern border. No other liberal democracy - from Canada to Finland to Japan to Australia - would tolerate such a flood of illegal immigration. Not even remotely close. Canada freaks out when a couple thousand illegal immigrants cross into its territory from the US…

No other "liberal democracy" has spent decades destabilizing democratically elected regimes, propping up dictators, and applying economic sanctions in nearby nations in the name of fighting communism, causing a massive flood of refugees fleeing those nations.

Why can't America try paying the cost of its actions for once, instead of pushing those costs on innocent families and children fleeing famine and violence?

Re: Trade War Has Damaged U.S. Chip Industry

#142

Post by AnthonyMouse »

zanny wrote: post #129
sigzero wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Getting rid of the Electoral College would destroy America. You would basically have two large areas control the whole process. Nope, no thank you. The only reason it failed last time is Hillary failed to understand it.

Mind blowing that a majority of the people might win a democratic election. Its all hyperbole overshadowing the root problem - first past the post non-proportional elections are hugely undemocratic. You need proportional legislatures where you have both multiple winners per race for better proportional distribution and alternate votes to first past the post regardless of what they are - STV, ranked choice, IRV, etc.…

> STV, ranked choice, IRV, etc.

What we really need is approval voting / range voting. First past the post creates polarization because it causes there to be two parties and requires every issue to be bifurcated into on of those two boxes, and if your preferences don't all perfectly align with party lines then welcome to hell.

But the problem with proportional representation systems is that they would require flipping over the table in the US. Senators are from specific states, Congressmen are from specific districts, and that part of the system isn't the broken part, it's actually helpful -- if your state or district has a specific problem then you have a specific person who actually cares about it because your vote matters more to them than the vote of someone else in some other place.

But apply range voting to the same districts and states and you don't end up with a two party system, because two very similar candidates no longer split the vote with each other. Then anybody who can represent a given district or state better than the incumbent can win the election regardless of party affiliation, and you're no longer stuck choosing between two party platforms because now there are twelve.

Re: Trade War Has Damaged U.S. Chip Industry

#143

Post by cmurf »

roenxi wrote: post #83
typon wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unbelievable how Americans can be so brainwashed about their country's status in the world yet believe that they're completely "free"

It is easy to complain generally, but is is better to be specific about what ways you think America is not free. Americans still enjoy great freedom of speech and association, for example. No Lèse-majesté in the land of the free. There is a lot of propaganda but that isn't necessarily inconsistent with freedom. The real issue is there is a risk that economically speaking America is less free than China. For all that…

>better to be specific

The word nation is not found in either the Declaration of Independence, or the Constitution. I consider nationalism, nationalistic movements, to be anti-freedom, they engender only division, hatred, enemy seeking, scapegoating, and laws to protect and enhance such things. Who is free in the U.S.? Perhaps citizens? There is even a movement that only natural born citizens are real citizens, and naturalized citizens are second class and could have citizenship stripped from them after the fact if they violate certain laws. It's not enough to imprison them, they have to be stripped of citizenship, in this view.

What about all persons within the U.S. are they free? The constitution applies mostly to persons, not just citizens. Most all individual rights and protections apply to persons; citizens get some extra privileges like holding federal public office. And yet a great many Americans are very confused about this, thinking constitutional law, rights and protections only apply to citizens.

Therefore I put nationalism as my specific enemy of the American dream, and of freedom. Patriotism is quite nice, in particular as it relates to America as an asylum for most of its history. But when patriotism is infected with nationalism, it becomes jingoism, and that's dangerous. Eventually no one is free.

Re: Trade War Has Damaged U.S. Chip Industry

#144

Post by cmurf »

adventured wrote: post #100
olefoo wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That is balanced by the strictly superior American rule of law The rule of law is looking pretty tattered and worn in the US of A right now. What with the President committing obstruction of justice in plain view and his AG declaring that a sitting President may not be indicted for any crime. Not to mention the grotesque violations of human rights that are happening at the network of concentration camps the current…

The US is not running a network of concentration camps. A hundred thousand illegal immigrants per month are being caught crossing into the US through the southern border. No other liberal democracy - from Canada to Finland to Japan to Australia - would tolerate such a flood of illegal immigration. Not even remotely close. Canada freaks out when a couple thousand illegal immigrants cross into its territory from the US…

Completely false in every way including the appeal to history.

The 1951 Convention on the Status of Refugees grants refugees very specific rights that are absolutely being violated by this policy, and the term "concentration camp" has been used in many other cases other than WWII concentration camps to mean exactly the thing the U.S. is doing to refugees on the southern border. I definitely consider them concentration camps, while as yet not being death camps. There already should be holy hell to pay for having done yet again what we promised never to do the last time we had concentration camps, for Japanese-American citizens.

https://www.sltrib.com/opinion/editorial/2019/06/22/tribune-...

Re: Trade War Has Damaged U.S. Chip Industry

#145

Post by danharaj »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #133
danharaj wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Call a spade a spade. It's a concentration camp because it's a camp where undesirable people are concentrated . The fact that you think it's justified to employ concentration camps is a separate argument.

"Concentration camp" has a specific connotation. Calling this a concentration camp is like calling a terminal cancer ward a "death camp" because people go there to die. Fault Trump with everything that's his fault, but suggesting that this is a precursor to mass graves and genocide is just hyperbole.

> Calling this a concentration camp is like calling a terminal cancer ward a "death camp" because people go there to die.

No, it isn't. Concentration camps have existed throughout history and they haven't always been associated with genocide. But, you know, they do have a connotation of being associated with violations of human rights which is exactly what people are alleging about these detention sites.

The fact that it's not literally the holocaust doesn't mean it's not a concentration camp.

Re: Trade War Has Damaged U.S. Chip Industry

#146

Post by maypeacepreva1l »

mistermann wrote: post #132
maypeacepreva1l wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am curious how you justify your position by looking at few members of the team. Trade is a complex issue and Trump single handedly is jeopardizing this sensitive topic by openly declaring trade wars with multiple nations in open platform like Twitter. Where were those members when that was and is still happening?

> I am curious how you justify your position by looking at few members of the team. If you review my comment carefully, you may notice (especially prior to my edit) that I haven't stated a particularly strong or distinct "position". Rather, I was asking a specific question about the specific literal words of someone else's stated position/belief. I suspect that what has happened here in both cases is that subconsciou…

You are suggesting Trump is doing this based on recommendation of his team or in depth analysis of the topic. Your proof being members of his team. Even though trade is complex issue, people will understand careful diplomacy. What Trump is doing is like carrying a sledge hammer and out in full swing against trading nations. There is no pattern or logic to it, other than scare tactics. If you can point out to why you think he is doing this in more convincing manner then I think you might not have been downvoted.

Re: Trade War Has Damaged U.S. Chip Industry

#147

Post by josephdviviano »

warmwaffles wrote: post #135
zanny wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mind blowing that a majority of the people might win a democratic election. Its all hyperbole overshadowing the root problem - first past the post non-proportional elections are hugely undemocratic. You need proportional legislatures where you have both multiple winners per race for better proportional distribution and alternate votes to first past the post regardless of what they are - STV, ranked choice, IRV, etc.…

> Mind blowing that a majority of the people might win a democratic election. People in dense urban areas should not have a dictatorial say in what those who live in rural areas do.

Yes but also, people in rural areas should not have a dictatorial say in what those who live in urban areas do.

If democracies like the USA (Canada has a similar problem) simply counted the votes, the majority of the country would be happier with the outcome. From a pragmatic standpoint, this is a good thing.

"U.S. Cities are Home to 62.7 Percent of the U.S. Population, but Comprise Just 3.5 Percent of Land Area"

https://www.census.gov/newsroom/press-releases/2015/cb15-33....

Re: Trade War Has Damaged U.S. Chip Industry

#148

Post by kazagistar »

pm90 wrote: post #115
rhino369 wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are just rationalizing China’s purposeful one way trade barriers.

Explain to me how billions of dollars in subsidies for agriculture are not one way trade barriers.

If all China was doing was investing in it's own industries and sponsoring them, it would be very different from it's current policy of actually locking out competitors who dont have a local presence and such. There is a steep difference between positive economic assistance and negative legal barriers.

Re: Trade War Has Damaged U.S. Chip Industry

#149

Post by [deleted] »

danharaj wrote: post #117
adventured wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US is not running a network of concentration camps. A hundred thousand illegal immigrants per month are being caught crossing into the US through the southern border. No other liberal democracy - from Canada to Finland to Japan to Australia - would tolerate such a flood of illegal immigration. Not even remotely close. Canada freaks out when a couple thousand illegal immigrants cross into its territory from the US…

Call a spade a spade. It's a concentration camp because it's a camp where undesirable people are concentrated . The fact that you think it's justified to employ concentration camps is a separate argument.

[deleted]
Post reply on HN