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California’s mountain lion faces ‘extinction vortex’

latimes.com

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Re: California’s mountain lion faces ‘extinction vortex’

#11

Post by paulcole »

everdev wrote: post #10
paulcole wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Mountain lions can pose a real threat to small children, so literally, pick up your kids with you if you see a mountain close by. While not awful advice, it's also vastly overblowing the true (nonexistent) danger mountain lions pose. Mountain lions are one of the smallest threats imaginable to anyone, small children included. 99.99% of people will never ever ever even be fortunate enough to see a mountain lion in t…

I live in CA near Santa Cruz and we have had mountain lions in our backyard. I've seen them close up and was not scared for the reasons you mentioned, it wanted to be seen. I had a slightly scarier incident where I was hissed at from thick bushes by a mountain lion that I couldn't see, but I left and the lion did not follow. It's extremely common in our area for lions to attack and kill small dogs and livestock. For…

Yeah, I've seen one while trail running in Oregon. While scary (came around a blind turn before sunrise and it was about 20' away), it clearly wanted nothing to do with me. Just stopped, looked at me, and wandered off the trail. One of the most memorable wildlife encounters I've had in my life.

Re: California’s mountain lion faces ‘extinction vortex’

#12

Post by malvosenior »

> In addition, large-scale residential and commercial development could be prohibited or limited in mountain lion habitats within a region covering roughly a third of the state.

It seems like something has to give. In particular, we can't have reasonable housing prices, a healthy mountain lion habitat and increased immigration and population (especially in California). Those three things are directly at odds with each other.

I don't know what the answer is, but it seems likely that mountain lions will end up as the lowest priority.

Re: California’s mountain lion faces ‘extinction vortex’

#13

Post by jacurtis »

paulcole wrote: post #7
mark_l_watson wrote: post #5

I lived in California my whole life before moving to Arizona about twenty years ago. I saw a mountain lion in Carlsbad California right before we moved. It was standing next busy College Avenue waiting for a break in traffic, then trotted across the street. Now living in the mountains of Central Arizona, there is more potential for seeing them. We have had tracks under our deck and very early in the morning I saw one…

> Mountain lions can pose a real threat to small children, so literally, pick up your kids with you if you see a mountain close by. While not awful advice, it's also vastly overblowing the true (nonexistent) danger mountain lions pose. Mountain lions are one of the smallest threats imaginable to anyone, small children included. 99.99% of people will never ever ever even be fortunate enough to see a mountain lion in t…

Mountain Lions are like Sharks of the land. What I mean by that is that their danger is wildly overblown in movies and news.

Statistically speaking, attacks from both animals are insanely rare.

For example, there have only been 25 deaths from Mountain Lions in North America since we began recording these in the 1800s.

By comparison, fatal shark attacks are over 6 times more likely to occur with about 1 shark attack in North America per year on average.

So it is interesting that whenever we go hiking in the woods or see a mountain lion cross the street, the news reports it and everyone loses their minds. Dying to a mountain lion is one of the rarest ways to die from a statistical perspective. There are rare diseases that you have never heard of that are more likely to kill you.

Every time we put our toe in the water people fear shark attacks. A rogue swell is more likely to capsize your boat than for you to be attacked by a shark, yet some people live in fear of it.

Also if you have hiked any considerable amount in the Rocky Mountains or Sierra Nevada mountain ranges than you have almost certainly had a Mountain Lion watch you, probably several times. Despite the fact, you have never seen it.

Bears are another one. I have encountered so many bears in the wild that I seriously don't even have a count for it anymore. I have stumbled on them less than 100 feet away from me on several occasions and guess what happens... they look me square in the eyes and then calmly turn around and walk away. Sometimes they run away, but they have no interest in killing me. I have never had one approach me once we became aware of the presence of each other.

I hike and camp A LOT, and I have NEVER seen a mountain lion in the wild, despite living in areas of their prime habitat where we know they live. I have seen virtually every other native large animal species on multiple occasions. But I have never seen a mountain lion in the wild. But I can guarantee you that they have seen me several times. That is what is scary about mountain lions. If you ever did get attacked, it would be over before you knew what was happening.

I have seen mountain lions cross the road twice in Park City, UT now. I have seen them in zoos as well. But just never seen one in the wild. Despite spending enough time to encounter bears on 20+ occasions.

Re: California’s mountain lion faces ‘extinction vortex’

#14

Post by uniformlyrandom »

setr wrote: post #6

What the hell is an extinction vortex? The article refuses to define it, despite scare-quoting the term itself.. >“Individual lions face horrible deaths from car collisions or rat poison, while their populations become increasingly isolated and inbred in ever-shrinking islands of habitat hemmed by freeways and sprawl.” Is this it? It doesn't really fit the name that well..

Second paragraph defines it:

> Mountain lions as a species are not threatened in California, but a petition submitted Tuesday to the state Fish and Game Commission argues that six isolated and genetically distinct cougar clans from Santa Cruz to the U.S.-Mexico border comprise a subpopulation that is threatened by extinction.

I understand it lacks the 'We define extinction vortex as...' preamble, but you can easily infer it.

Re: California’s mountain lion faces ‘extinction vortex’

#15

Post by bloak »

Can any Californian say something about the relative frequency of the various names for this species?

I'd never heard the term "mountain lion" until recently (I think I first encountered it in a story by Annie Proulx) though I've known the word "puma" since the 1970s. Apparently they're also known as "cougar" or "catamount". I probably came across the term "cougar" some time this century, and the term "catamount" a few minutes ago.

Re: California’s mountain lion faces ‘extinction vortex’

#17

Post by jvanderbot »

bloak wrote: post #15

Can any Californian say something about the relative frequency of the various names for this species? I'd never heard the term "mountain lion" until recently (I think I first encountered it in a story by Annie Proulx) though I've known the word "puma" since the 1970s. Apparently they're also known as "cougar" or "catamount". I probably came across the term "cougar" some time this century, and the term "catamount" a f…

Everyone I know around here calls them mountain lions. I've heard cougar occasionally, but that word conflicts with other relevant topics in Los Angeles ...

Re: California’s mountain lion faces ‘extinction vortex’

#18

Post by idlewords »

bloak wrote: post #15

Can any Californian say something about the relative frequency of the various names for this species? I'd never heard the term "mountain lion" until recently (I think I first encountered it in a story by Annie Proulx) though I've known the word "puma" since the 1970s. Apparently they're also known as "cougar" or "catamount". I probably came across the term "cougar" some time this century, and the term "catamount" a f…

I blame Apple's naming scheme for OS X for the sudden diversity of big cat names.

Re: California’s mountain lion faces ‘extinction vortex’

#19

Post by uniformlyrandom »

bloak wrote: post #15

Can any Californian say something about the relative frequency of the various names for this species? I'd never heard the term "mountain lion" until recently (I think I first encountered it in a story by Annie Proulx) though I've known the word "puma" since the 1970s. Apparently they're also known as "cougar" or "catamount". I probably came across the term "cougar" some time this century, and the term "catamount" a f…

In bay area, we call them mountain lions. Because this is what park warning signs call them.

Re: California’s mountain lion faces ‘extinction vortex’

#20

Post by SolaceQuantum »

malvosenior wrote: post #12

> In addition, large-scale residential and commercial development could be prohibited or limited in mountain lion habitats within a region covering roughly a third of the state. It seems like something has to give. In particular, we can't have reasonable housing prices, a healthy mountain lion habitat and increased immigration and population (especially in California). Those three things are directly at odds with eac…

I've heard from other californians elsewhere in HN that issues with housing is from lack of density, not lack of housing space.
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