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I just had over a thousand Euros stolen and Revolut is siding with the thief

stavros.io

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Re: I just had over a thousand Euros stolen and Revolut is siding with the thief

#221

Post by solarkraft »

mschuster91 wrote: post #74
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You mostly can't talk to anyone No phone number should be a dealbreaker for banking. 99% of the time, you don’t want to talk to a banker. But that 1% of the time can make or break you for months or years. These start-ups ( e.g. Bank Simple, Revolut, et cetera ) prey on consumers who have only experienced the 99%. You don’t want to have a 1% event, like fraud, or an issue overseas, or a liquidity crisis, with a serv…

> 99% of the time, you don’t want to talk to a banker. But that 1% of the time can make or break you for months or years. This is why I still use my local Sparkasse (credit union) and pay ~9€ a month. They can sort out pretty much everything instantly - need a second card for your s/o, a secondary account for handling freelancer income, or a loan? No problem, show up and get what you want. Additionally: when you're u…

> you will be paying more interest than if you apply for a credit at the bank that has handled your business over decades.

Is this actually true? That would be a real reason for me to do the same, but if not I would prefer my money to stay with the GLS, which invests it ethically.

Re: I just had over a thousand Euros stolen and Revolut is siding with the thief

#222

Post by icebraining »

StavrosK wrote: post #106
thefounder wrote: post #40

Credit/debit cards are outdated and should be replaced by flexible and safer methods that allow fine-grained control over the payment (i.e one time payment, recurring, limits on recurring etc). Everyone with your card number can take money from your account. How stupid is that? Like giving the user/pass of your online banking.

Exactly, I don't understand why we can't do "push" money transfers and we have to do "pull"... Cryptocurrencies have a much better use case when it comes to the transaction UX. I also think some countries like the Netherlands have a "push" system that seems convenient.

Many countries have that (e.g. Portugal has had it for over a decade), the problem is that they generally don't work across borders. Hopefully SEPA can help with that.

Re: I just had over a thousand Euros stolen and Revolut is siding with the thief

#223

Post by oarsinsync »

madeofpalk wrote: post #100
thomersch_ wrote: post #4

"How hard must being a bank be, it's just a few numbers in a database." After all those new-ish, app-based banks are for people with too much time on their hands. You mostly can't talk to anyone, and when they answer it's just a copy-paste from their FAQ. They also lack features, e.g. Kontist doesn't support international bank transfers. Support will tell you "well it could work, but we can't give you any assistance"…

For what it's worth, Monzo seems to be the only 'challenger bank' that's getting this right. They have the 24/7 in-app chat support that's super helpful, but then also a phone number you can call if you're into that. My every interaction with them as a customer has been fantastic.

I've had negative but acceptable experiences with Monzo and Starling. Would recommend both of them, and actively use both myself.

I've had negative and intolerable experiences with Curve, TransferWise, Tide, and Revolut. I would recommend avoiding all of them. Not all of them offer banking solutions (Curve being the odd one out in that list), but the three that do are all e-money, which I guess speaks for itself.

Re: I just had over a thousand Euros stolen and Revolut is siding with the thief

#224

Post by briandear »

kevin_b_er wrote: post #212
eloisant wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In France any transaction involving you PIN code is really hard to contest (so if you get your card copied by a skimmer it's tough). Same with online transactions using 3-D secure (2-factor, usually involving a confirmation code sent by SMS). For other online transactions however, you just have to ask your bank and they're chargeback the merchant.

This sounds like the same fallacy the UK had with chip transactions. The magical fallacy that they're infallible and totally secure, thus all fraudulent transactions are automatically your fault.

It’s interesting that there was quite the criticism of the US “mag stripe” cards when Europe was chip and pin. I recall many Europeans claiming that their system was far more secure and “better.” However, chip and pin puts liability on the customer for fraudulent transactions, while in the US, the liability is on the merchant.

Re: I just had over a thousand Euros stolen and Revolut is siding with the thief

#225

Post by JumpCrisscross »

krn wrote: post #218
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why does being regulated by Lithuania make it look it like a money-laundering scheme? It doesn't raise issues per se . But Lithuania has a sizable Russian population [1]. It's also a small country. The latter means it has less experience supervising novel and complex financial systems. It also makes its regulators easier to unduly influence, either through bribery or threats ( e.g. Revolut failing would probably de…

A Lithuanian here. > But Lithuania has a sizable Russian population [1]. It's also a small country. The Russian population (5%) is a tiny minority here, not represented by any political party in the parlament. It's much bigger (25%) in Latvia and Estonia, as Russians tend to live in the cities near the Russian border[1]. > The latter means it has less experience supervising novel and complex financial systems. It als…

> Those policitians who tried to oppose giving the license to Revolut were publicly attacked from all sides as "working on behalf of Scandinavian banks"

I rest my case. That such financial regulation is being politically decided gives Revolut more leeway in Lithuania than it would have in e.g. the U.K.

Re: I just had over a thousand Euros stolen and Revolut is siding with the thief

#226

Post by treis »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #152
treis wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The Department does not regulate national banks (examples: Bank of America, Wells Fargo, Chase, Citibank, PNC) or federal credit unions, whether operating in Georgia or elsewhere. https://dbf.georgia.gov/consumer-resources

It doesn't regulate, but depending on the state they'll often mediate. (New York has mediated disputes between national banks and me, for instance.) Otherwise, the OCC [1] is worth a try. [1] https://www.occ.gov/topics/consumer-protection/index-consume...

I mean, the CFPP mediated my dispute as well. Chase told me to go fuck myself and CFPP dutifully reported that to me. The question is whether these organizations can sit as an objective third party, look at my dispute, and force Chase to do the right thing.

Re: I just had over a thousand Euros stolen and Revolut is siding with the thief

#227

Post by chx »

StavrosK wrote: post #112
chx wrote: post #89

There is a simple yardstick that made me stay far, far away from Revolut: they deal with bitcoin. I will never trust a single cent of my money on such a company. So far the conduct of Bitcoin exchanges didn't impart the impression of responsible companies. Oftentimes you have downright conmen running them. This is not to say Revolut is cooking the books but touching bitcoin by a fiscal company carries a stench, one t…

They don't actually deal with cryptocurrencies (like, you can't buy BTC with them). They just added tickers and let you gamble with the price.

Huh? https://www.revolut.com/exchange-cryptocurrency "Instantly exchange any of our 29 currencies directly into Bitcoin, Litecoin, Ethereum, Bitcoin Cash and XRP, and all without breaking a sweat."

Re: I just had over a thousand Euros stolen and Revolut is siding with the thief

#228

Post by prima-facie »

StavrosK wrote: post #34
ajdlinux wrote: post #6

FWIW - having to wait for pending transactions to post before filing a chargeback is how traditional banks have treated me, and I'm guessing is probably just part of the Visa/Mastercard dispute resolution process (someone who knows better might correct me here). Though you'd think a next-gen mobile-only bank would be able to put some additional automation around the process so that they would contact you again on the…

> having to wait for pending transactions to post before filing a chargeback is how traditional banks have treated me Yeah, I guess they have a reason for doing that, though I don't know what it is. Still, I would have thought they can cancel it in cases of fraud? Maybe it's so you can't "dine and dash" or similar.

That's why they are called _transactions_. They are an immutable journal of amounts coming in and going out.

Re: I just had over a thousand Euros stolen and Revolut is siding with the thief

#229

Post by StavrosK »

chx wrote: post #227
StavrosK wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They don't actually deal with cryptocurrencies (like, you can't buy BTC with them). They just added tickers and let you gamble with the price.

Huh? https://www.revolut.com/exchange-cryptocurrency "Instantly exchange any of our 29 currencies directly into Bitcoin, Litecoin, Ethereum, Bitcoin Cash and XRP, and all without breaking a sweat."

Yeah, they don't let you withdraw or deposit any. You have to convert it back to fiat to withdraw.

Re: I just had over a thousand Euros stolen and Revolut is siding with the thief

#230

Post by krn »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #225
krn wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A Lithuanian here. > But Lithuania has a sizable Russian population [1]. It's also a small country. The Russian population (5%) is a tiny minority here, not represented by any political party in the parlament. It's much bigger (25%) in Latvia and Estonia, as Russians tend to live in the cities near the Russian border[1]. > The latter means it has less experience supervising novel and complex financial systems. It als…

> Those policitians who tried to oppose giving the license to Revolut were publicly attacked from all sides as "working on behalf of Scandinavian banks" I rest my case. That such financial regulation is being politically decided gives Revolut more leeway in Lithuania than it would have in e.g. the U.K.

> That such financial regulation is being politically decided

It's not being politically decided, but multiple senior members of the parlament in the committee on Budget and Finance have publicly expressed their concerns.

I agree that there is a lot of general inexperience in the entire system, and I don't believe that Lithuania would be able to regulate Revolut properly, as it's based in the UK.

The point was, that Revolut was more than welcome in Lithuania, and they didn't need to try to influence anyone. The politicians and regulators were even proud that one of the biggest fintech startups in Europe chose to set foot here.

They also saw that N26 was successfully granted a license in Germany, Monzo in the UK, and Bunq in Netherlands. Therefore, it wasn't seen as such a big risk.

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