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'Living drug' offers hope to terminal blood cancer patients

bbc.co.uk

21–30 of 41 posts

Re: 'Living drug' offers hope to terminal blood cancer patients

#21
post #2

This reads like the prelude to 90% of all zombie movies - cheating death by injecting virusses, starting in the UK. It even includes a fever and neurotoxicity as side effects.

Not starting in the UK. These therapies were invented and first approved in the US (CAR-T was invented at Penn and MSKCC)

Re: 'Living drug' offers hope to terminal blood cancer patients

#22
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, how do they move if their muscles have rotted away and they have no functioning circulatory system?

Yup. Turns out, the organs in the body have a purpose, and without them the body can't work :-) I.e. zombies are magical creatures, even less plausible than godzilla. I also curmudgeonly think that Game of Thrones lost its appeal when it stopped being about political intrigue and became yet another silly magical zombie movie.

> I also curmudgeonly think that Game of Thrones lost its appeal when it stopped being about political intrigue and became yet another silly magical zombie movie.

So the very first scene of both the books and tv show?

Re: 'Living drug' offers hope to terminal blood cancer patients

#23
post #2

This reads like the prelude to 90% of all zombie movies - cheating death by injecting virusses, starting in the UK. It even includes a fever and neurotoxicity as side effects.

I wouldn't worry about zombies. They violate conservation of energy laws, for one.

Where do zombies violate conservation of energy? They do wear down eventually, and fresh brains are low entropy and also nutrient dense.

Re: 'Living drug' offers hope to terminal blood cancer patients

#24
Vice on HBO did an episode back in 2015 looking at several different experimental (at the time) cancer treatments which included a segment on the fourth patient to receive CAR-T.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FlK-PeCfezM

The CAR-T segment starts at 27:30.

Re: 'Living drug' offers hope to terminal blood cancer patients

#25
post #17

Not mentioned here: the same results can in many cases be had from BiTEs at lower cost and without having to ship leukapheresis samples to the US in liquid nitrogen Having seen both ALL and AML patients relapsing through CAR-T, I don’t think people appreciate either the systemic load or the possibility of treatment failure that exists in real patient populations. Neither was elderly; 26yo female ALL and 5yo female AM…

It's not really fair to compare BiTEs to first gen CAR. Bispecific (or tri/quad specific) CAR have a greatly reduced rate of relapse due to antigen loss (likely what is causing most relapse in these diseases). Re: BiTEs, it's not clear they'll produce durable cures like CAR does. They're just antibodies, and will eventually be cleared. With CAR, if you can get a response, you can generate memory T-cells and control a…

Immunotherapy is really fascinating, I know someone going through it right now and it seems to be helping (early days yet, of course).

I was very curious to read that it had such severe side-effects, especially the neurotoxicity. Why such a severe reaction? Does the neurotoxicity have developmental impacts for children that receive immunotherapy?

Re: 'Living drug' offers hope to terminal blood cancer patients

#26
post #17

Not mentioned here: the same results can in many cases be had from BiTEs at lower cost and without having to ship leukapheresis samples to the US in liquid nitrogen Having seen both ALL and AML patients relapsing through CAR-T, I don’t think people appreciate either the systemic load or the possibility of treatment failure that exists in real patient populations. Neither was elderly; 26yo female ALL and 5yo female AM…

> For CAR-T therapy, the common remark is “you know it’s working when the patient goes to the ICU” from tumor lysis

Why is that not also true in chemo patients?

Re: 'Living drug' offers hope to terminal blood cancer patients

#27
post #17

Not mentioned here: the same results can in many cases be had from BiTEs at lower cost and without having to ship leukapheresis samples to the US in liquid nitrogen Having seen both ALL and AML patients relapsing through CAR-T, I don’t think people appreciate either the systemic load or the possibility of treatment failure that exists in real patient populations. Neither was elderly; 26yo female ALL and 5yo female AM…

> For CAR-T therapy, the common remark is “you know it’s working when the patient goes to the ICU” from tumor lysis Why is that not also true in chemo patients?

(note, I'm not the right type of doctor to answer this properly, but my understanding is...)

A lot of chemos are some type of poison, only slightly worse for the tumor than it is for the rest of your body. It doesn't die fast enough (and if it did, you'd be killing the rest of you too). Think months / years with chemo vs. weeks with CAR-T.

Re: 'Living drug' offers hope to terminal blood cancer patients

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> For CAR-T therapy, the common remark is “you know it’s working when the patient goes to the ICU” from tumor lysis Why is that not also true in chemo patients?

(note, I'm not the right type of doctor to answer this properly, but my understanding is...) A lot of chemos are some type of poison, only slightly worse for the tumor than it is for the rest of your body. It doesn't die fast enough (and if it did, you'd be killing the rest of you too). Think months / years with chemo vs. weeks with CAR-T.

Ah, so it just kills it faster?

I know a child with leukemia who recently started chemo. They had him on sodium bicarbonate and other medication to reduce the acidity of his urine (to compensate for the increased amount of uric acid). However, they only had him on it for the first few days of chemo. My understanding was that the bulk of the chemolysis occured in that period (though I could be mistaken).

Re: 'Living drug' offers hope to terminal blood cancer patients

#30
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup. Turns out, the organs in the body have a purpose, and without them the body can't work :-) I.e. zombies are magical creatures, even less plausible than godzilla. I also curmudgeonly think that Game of Thrones lost its appeal when it stopped being about political intrigue and became yet another silly magical zombie movie.

Zombies aren't the only magic in Game of Thrones. They're fantasy novels. If it weren't for the zombies, the political story would just be about people fighting each other for advantage. The zombies add a tension between that and a common cause, since the threat faces them all; much like the world we live in today.

I'm guessing they didn't stick around for the dragons.
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