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Minimum Wage Still Can’t Pay For A Two-Bedroom Apartment Anywhere

citylab.com

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Re: Minimum Wage Still Can’t Pay For A Two-Bedroom Apartment Anywhere

#111

Post by maxlybbert »

mlevental wrote: post #42
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it in no way makes sense for someone to hire a first time employee who still lives with their parents for a zero skill job at the rate of "enough to afford a two-bedroom house".

> a first time employee who still lives with their parents what makes you think this is the typical minimum wage earner?

The minimum wage is “the least you can pay anyone for any reason.” If you set it too high, then first time workers who still live with their parents won’t be able to get jobs. At all.

Re: Minimum Wage Still Can’t Pay For A Two-Bedroom Apartment Anywhere

#112

Post by zelon88 »

throwaway98434 wrote: post #8

This article like so many others makes a critical mistake in using a median price for minimum earners. A minimum wage earner is not and should not be in the market for a median priced home. A median wage earner would pursue a median priced home. A bottom quartile earner would pursue homes priced in the bottom quartile. Not the median. The title of this article is false. Minimum wage earners can often afford two bedro…

Don't forget most people looking for two+ bedroom homes have kids.

Re: Minimum Wage Still Can’t Pay For A Two-Bedroom Apartment Anywhere

#113

Post by mlevental »

maxlybbert wrote: post #111
mlevental wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a first time employee who still lives with their parents what makes you think this is the typical minimum wage earner?

The minimum wage is “the least you can pay anyone for any reason.” If you set it too high, then first time workers who still live with their parents won’t be able to get jobs. At all.

that has almost nothing to do with what i asked

Re: Minimum Wage Still Can’t Pay For A Two-Bedroom Apartment Anywhere

#115

Post by Damorian »

mgraczyk wrote: post #15

On the other hand, if this weren't the case I think it would be even more strange. "Law requires companies to automate or illegally hire any job worth less than a 2-bedroom home"

Is there anything wrong with this? If a job can't provide for a person at some (philosophically debatable) level, it's not a job worth doing, free market be damned. We could take this to a logical extreme and think of all the jobs that could exist in the absence of a minimum wage and basic human necessity, but the reality is both of these exist. Either it's "worth" more for an employer to pay them more, or automating it becomes more competitive. Both of these drive innovation and advance society. This is why I've supported a higher minimum wage.

Re: Minimum Wage Still Can’t Pay For A Two-Bedroom Apartment Anywhere

#116

Post by Johnny555 »

imgabe wrote: post #35
Johnny555 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's fine in an area where these better paying jobs are available, but in many areas of the country, well paying jobs for unskilled workers are scarce, and support systems to help these unskilled workers improve their skills are nonexistent. It can be hard to a person to pull himself out of life-long poverty.

And housing in those areas is also much cheaper.

But 2 bedroom housing is still out of reach, even in those areas according to the article.

Re: Minimum Wage Still Can’t Pay For A Two-Bedroom Apartment Anywhere

#117

Post by throwaway5752 »

throwaway98434 wrote: post #8

This article like so many others makes a critical mistake in using a median price for minimum earners. A minimum wage earner is not and should not be in the market for a median priced home. A median wage earner would pursue a median priced home. A bottom quartile earner would pursue homes priced in the bottom quartile. Not the median. The title of this article is false. Minimum wage earners can often afford two bedro…

People making the minimum wage can hardly get by anywhere in the US and have almost no social mobility because they can't buy homes and rent leaves little or no room for savings, particularly if they have families. Moreover the disparity between top and lowest quartiles is growing. Whatever the flaws of the article, it's a problem. It's a shame the article has those flaws (https://reports.nlihc.org/sites/default/files/oor/OOR_2019.p... is the original source for a lot of the article's and is worth reading instead) and everyone is focused on bikeshedding the analysis instead of getting the greater point.

Re: Minimum Wage Still Can’t Pay For A Two-Bedroom Apartment Anywhere

#118

Post by maxlybbert »

mlevental wrote: post #113
maxlybbert wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The minimum wage is “the least you can pay anyone for any reason.” If you set it too high, then first time workers who still live with their parents won’t be able to get jobs. At all.

that has almost nothing to do with what i asked

You asked “what makes you think this is the typical minimum wage earner?” I answered “if you don’t take that case into account when setting minimum wage, then that worker won’t be able to get a job.”

Minimum wage is the least you can pay anyone for any reason. It is, by definition, an edge case.

Re: Minimum Wage Still Can’t Pay For A Two-Bedroom Apartment Anywhere

#119

Post by notacoward »

sdinsn wrote: post #68
atonse wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or maybe we can actually pay people a wage allowing them to lead some semblance of a decent life? Why does it fall on them, instead of the actual businesses paying them?

> some semblance of a decent life Having roommates is fine and not a big deal.

Maybe not for you. For the 37-year-old average retail worker, who might have kids and might not have many other skills, maybe not so much. Not everyone is like you. In particular, many people in the demographic we're talking about might not be like anyone you've ever spent any time with.

Re: Minimum Wage Still Can’t Pay For A Two-Bedroom Apartment Anywhere

#120

Post by leetcrew »

Broken_Hippo wrote: post #105
viklove wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're working a minimum wage job, maybe don't have kids?

So, if you had kids while you had a decent job and the place closes, you should give away the kids because your replacement job is minimum wage? Is it the same if you wind up disabled and suddenly become a low earner? Or, I know, celibacy for everyone and hope you don't get raped? Free abortions when birth control fails, if you can afford birth control and aren't unlucky enough to have issues with it? Do you happen t…

> So, if you had kids while you had a decent job and the place closes, you should give away the kids because your replacement job is minimum wage?

suddenly becoming unable to provide for your kids through no fault of your own is quite different from deciding to have children when you know (or should know) you already have no ability to support them. in both cases, we need to at least do something to help the children, but we have to structure it carefully to avoid encouraging the latter.

> Do you happen to know the income level when kids are affordable?

no, but I can look at what I spend to sustain myself every month. if I can't comfortably double that, I'm probably not ready to have my first child.

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