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Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

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Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#241

Post by rock_hard »

arzeth wrote: post #38

I have a hotkey in i3wm: bindsym $mod+backslash exec "xcalib -i -a" which inverts all colors (btw, I have to `killall redshift` because of a bug). When colors are inverted, I feel almost undisturbed at any gruesome content (for me it's like seeing screenshots of Quake 2 with buggy GPU drivers), yet I can still easily recognise whether the content is disturbing. And when it's a video, I play it at ≥2x speed so that it…

There was a previous article a couple month ago that explained that this sort of stuff is already build into the moderation tools.

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#242

Post by bumby »

cabaalis wrote: post #223
bumby wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except we don't have those Ayn Rand-ian free markets for a reason. We have a whole host of workers rights in the U.S. because society realized that leaving everything up to free markets to take advantage of what they can may lead to bad outcomes.

Don't we still enjoy the results of those "bad outcomes", though? Huge cities built, railways across the country, massive industries and technology advancements from the period?

Sure, but this falls under "the ends justify the means", which I disagree with.

Take climate change. Just because we advanced because of our previous attitudes about carbon doesn't mean it's a good idea to continue doing so in the same regard.

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#243

Post by _bxg1 »

bena wrote: post #207
_bxg1 wrote: post #129

I think the most pertinent question is why don't they quit ? It says a great deal about how broken the United States' job market and social safety net are. If minimum wage were $15, they could find another job that paid their basic living expenses. If health care weren't left up to your employer, they wouldn't be out of luck while looking for a different job. If there were any alternative , they wouldn't stay in this…

That is true, but a common theme among many of the stories is how much more they pay compared to other places. These people are literally trading dollars for their mental health. That is the choice they are making.

Except those dollars amount to $28,800/year. Hardly enough to live on in the cities where these offices are, yet more than twice minimum wage ($15 full-time, versus $7.25 at what are often inconsistent hours [Edit: in Florida it's $8.46, but I think the point still stands]).

They aren't hustling because they want some extra cash. They're trading their mental health for the basic ability to be a living, eating human being.

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#244

Post by SpicyLemonZest »

Konnstann wrote: post #118
holidaygoose wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like content moderation is just a crazy wicked problem. And the company is doing the best it can with a lot of constraints. Better communication with the workers sounds like it would help, but what else should they be doing realistically?

When I started working with Class 3B lasers at my lab, I had to undergo an initial medical exam, and then periodic ones to make sure my eyesight wasn't being affected. Guess what the company should be doing?

I mean, come on. If the article had said there are mandatory mental health screenings, and mandatory transfers if you don’t pass, you know everyone would be pointing to it as another example of how the content moderators are being mistreated.

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#245

Post by JauntyHatAngle »

jumbopapa wrote: post #216
sandworm101 wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lol. Ever seen a migrant camp? Ever talked to a seasonal farm laborer? People will literally walk across continents for 30k/years. https://www.payscale.com/research/US/Job=Soldier/Salary

Sounds like $30k is an improvement in their lives then, so is it really "too little"?

It is very possible to "improve" somebody's life and still be abusing your power over them and causing them damage in other ways.

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#246

Post by acdha »

asark wrote: post #59
arethuza wrote: post #15

Maybe Facebook should make all of their own employees do 15 minutes of moderation per day - just to share the pain out a bit....

Make the users do a little every so often. Like Slashdot's "hey, go moderate some posts" thing but forced to before they can use the platform anymore. That'd be fun. Of course the real answer is that this sort of site is a bad idea and shouldn't exist. Wide-open signup and public visibility of content, or ease of sharing it with strangers. Bad combo, don't care how much money it's making them (and other, similar site…

There's not really a shortcut around having employees do it because Facebook has a significant amount of private content which users will not tolerate being shared, standards vary widely (imagine a vegan flagging every picture with leather visible or a post about eating meat as obscene — if you're requiring this, do you just disable their account once you notice it?), and especially because it's the target of coordinated group activity so errors won't be uncorrelated: get a cycle of outrage politics going and you'll have thousands of people around the world who have no easily-observed connection to each other flagging things as either objectionable or safe.

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#247

Post by reactorofr »

H8crilA wrote: post #184
anarchy8 wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't, because that would be horrible...

How much would you pay your house cleaner? 100k a year? Do you tip $100 USD in restaurants so that waiters can enjoy similar effective salary?

I would if I could, absolutely.

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#248

Post by Balgair »

I feel that we're going to view these places and these practices the same way we view children in coal mines or young women working with radium paint. I've got a feeling that though we know very little about this now, our children and grandchildren are going to know a lot about this.

Dear Lord, what a horrible thing.

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#249

Post by hvs »

doctorRetro wrote: post #225

“I think Facebook needs to shut down." As I've spent the last few years pissing away absurd amounts of time on the platform, gotten in countless fruitless arguments, and seen the truly vile and toxic elements of my communities exposed and worn like a badge, this is an idea I've been thinking an awful lot about. After reading this article, I've never been more certain of that statement.

"We have met the enemy and he is us." https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/49/Pogo_-_Earth_...

Shutting down FB will just create this problem in the next popular social media platform. This is a problem that needs to be solved, and shutting companies down won't do it.

Re: Facebook moderators break NDAs to expose working conditions

#250

Post by ameister14 »

lexapro wrote: post #186
H8crilA wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry but who wouldn't? I would.

Yeah, that's kinda how free markets work.

Except it's not, not really - Ford discovered that paying workers a better wage resulted in greater profitability and increased efficiency.
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