Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles • Hacker News Board

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#941

Post by hnick » Wed, Jun 19, 2019, 8:30 AM UTC

TheGRS wrote: post #610

pwg wrote: post #578

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As a User Experience Professional, I was never able to grasp the true user's need for touch screens in cars. You are viewing the 'need' from the end user perspective. That is likely not the driving force that is causing touch screen proliferation. The likely driving force that is causing it is the manufacturers BOM costs. A single, rectangular, touch screen, that can swallow up a bunch of different knobs and button…

Are knobs and plastic moldings that expensive though? I'm not sure this is really a driving factor. Touch screens have marketing appeal (at least from the seller's perspective), I have to think having a shiny touch screen on your new Mazda is simply just trying to get more people to purchase a new car and nothing more.

It's not just the up front cost. They can roll out updates and patches to change the functionality too.

Maybe throw in some cheeky DLC to unlock certain features too ;)

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#942

Post by sumedh » Wed, Jun 19, 2019, 10:06 AM UTC

rco8786 wrote: post #900

sumedh wrote: post #875

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point was you comparing a car to a phone does not make any sense right now. That elusive future where a car just becomes a device is not going to be here in the next few years, we can talk about it when it comes but right now cars kill people if you dont pay attention.

I think you're vastly underestimating how quickly car manufacturers are moving..or at least trying to move. Tesla is already pre-selling, for money, full self-driving capability in their existing cars. And they are, of course, designing their current fleet of cars for that future. There's already a Games section in the dashboard. We can talk about the safety aspects all day until we're blue in the face. But this is t…

I think you're vastly overestimating how quickly car manufacturers are moving

> Tesla is already pre-selling, for money, full self-driving capability in their existing cars.

Has Tesla enabled FSD with no driver supervision?

That is the actual reality.

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#943

Post by rbanffy » Wed, Jun 19, 2019, 10:47 AM UTC

yholio wrote: post #869

pugworthy wrote: post #777

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To quote the page linked earlier... > Crew Dragon will be a fully autonomous spacecraft that can also be monitored & controlled by on board astronauts and SpaceX mission control in Hawthorne, CA.

I would be very surprised if Dragon did not include the 21st century equivalent of the Apollo 8-ball, manual translation controller and stick. NASA is a very conservative organization and if there is a lesson to be learned from past near disasters, is how limited is the foresight of mission planners and how infinitely adaptable are the human astronauts.

It has a stick and a couple buttons for most of the functionality that can be useful to the pilots in case the craft misbehaves. It seems to have rotary input so it can manage rotation and translation.

A lot of the controls in an Apollo were to be used in normal manual operations that are automated (or have no counterpart) in Dragons.

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#944

Post by rbanffy » Wed, Jun 19, 2019, 10:50 AM UTC

m4rtink wrote: post #891

ceejayoz wrote: post #700

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A heavily vibrating vehicle which needs to be operated quickly and with 100% reliability by a human operator really should not be operated via a proliferation of touch screens and touch buttons as the images above show. In fairness to SpaceX, Dragon largely isn't designed to be operated by a human. There's a reason that page calls out stuff like "how warm should the cabin be" as the sort of decisions being made wit…

There are a few physical buttons for the few critical functions you might want to trigger in the boost/reentry phase. The rest is either 1 g or microgravity and a touchscreen should not be a problem. BTW, not surre if they implemented it in the end, but they planned to handle screen blurring due to vibrations by shifting the screen content based on accelerometer data in real time. A rather clever idea IMHO. :)

> they planned to handle screen blurring due to vibrations by shifting the screen content based on accelerometer data in real time

IIRC, Orion does that by timing the screen backlight.

If I had a choice between Orion, Starliner or Dragon, I'd go with the Dragon. The spacesuits are much nicer and if I have to die, I'd rather go with style.

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#945

Post by rbanffy » Wed, Jun 19, 2019, 10:52 AM UTC

petre wrote: post #848

gsnedders wrote: post #758

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Especially now the US and Canada requires reversing cameras in all new cars, there has to be a screen in the car; the question then becomes whether it's worthwhile designing a second infotainment system that doesn't require that (somewhat costly) large colour screen for lower end trims in markets where reversing cameras aren't mandatory, and it seems to be that manufacturers think that isn't worth the cost.

I wish they did that in the EU. Reversing cameras are massively useful, especially in vehicles with low visibility such as the Toyota CH-R.

Wouldn't it be better just to make cars with good visibility?

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#946

Post by rbanffy » Wed, Jun 19, 2019, 10:54 AM UTC

Steuard wrote: post #887

isostatic wrote: post #884

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a rather communist view. The free market allows people to buy cheaper cars at the expense of their safety, what's wrong with that?

Off the top of my head: * If the design of your car makes you a less safe driver, you are more likely to crash into me. * The US as a society has committed (surprisingly recently) to providing emergency care to anyone who shows up at a hospital before asking whether they can pay. Car accidents are a sadly common reason for people requiring emergency care. That means that reducing car accidents is a public benefit. *…

Poe's Law claims another victim.

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#947

Post by jacurtis » Wed, Jun 19, 2019, 12:53 PM UTC

celticmusic wrote: post #620

marapuru wrote: post #47

Praise to Mazda for making this decision. As a User Experience Professional, I was never able to grasp the true user's need for touch screens in cars. For years I have been working on product interfaces (not just apps). Many studies I conducted actually told me that people favored analog controls over digital touch screens controls. It gives you tactile feedback, making it accessible for anyone with sense of touch. >…

a thousand times this. A year or two ago I considered buying another car after I had a fedex semi hit me (turning left from a stop, not dangerous). I drive a 2004 corolla and love toyota, but the guy looked at me like I had grown frog legs when I asked if they had any models without the touchscreen. It was actually a major decision in me keeping my vehicle. I do NOT like the touchscreen, to me it's a complete no-brai…

Just something to consider is that Toyota panels do have external controls that allow you to use the panel without the touchscreen.

I have a 2016 Toyota Corolla, and the entertainment system is a touchscreen, but I haven't touched it in years. There are several knobs and buttons located around the screen and on the steering wheel that provide full control over the functions, without needing to physically touch the screen.

Maybe they have changes this in the last 3 years, but at least the 2016 models do have physical controls that are duplicated both on the entertainment panel and the steering wheel.

While there is a touchscreen, you don't need to touch it.

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#948

Post by tracker1 » Wed, Jun 19, 2019, 3:41 PM UTC

marapuru wrote: post #47

Praise to Mazda for making this decision. As a User Experience Professional, I was never able to grasp the true user's need for touch screens in cars. For years I have been working on product interfaces (not just apps). Many studies I conducted actually told me that people favored analog controls over digital touch screens controls. It gives you tactile feedback, making it accessible for anyone with sense of touch. >…

I've hated touch screens in cars... I generally rely on bluetooth, only because the controls are so bad, at least with BT I can pick up my phone and bring it into view if needed, but the steering controls handle next navigation, which along with volume are about 95% of interactivity. The other 5% being maps.

If the Mazda navigation/interaction/entertainment experience is better, I'm definitely in favor. I miss the in-between period, where I could just insert a USB drive with sorted directories of mp3s and use that easily.

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#949

Post by tracker1 » Wed, Jun 19, 2019, 3:47 PM UTC

namdnay wrote: post #856

petre wrote: post #848

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish they did that in the EU. Reversing cameras are massively useful, especially in vehicles with low visibility such as the Toyota CH-R.

Really? As much as I like the comfort of the rear radars for big vehicles, I’ve always found the camera a bit useless

I LOVE mine... with the guide lines for reversing, I always center into the space as desired... it's easier than pulling in forward even. For times when the neighboring spaces are wonky, it's easier to short shrift the passenger side, aligned with the other car's passenger side, so worst case you have to pull out to let a passenger in.

Also, if every other car parked forward/reverse then the more cramped spaces wouldn't be as difficult. Note, I live in AZ, USA where more than half the cars are full sized or larger vehicles. So parking lots designed for cities with smaller vehicles are particularly difficult.

Re: Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

#950

Post by tracker1 » Wed, Jun 19, 2019, 3:51 PM UTC

Steuard wrote: post #887

isostatic wrote: post #884

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a rather communist view. The free market allows people to buy cheaper cars at the expense of their safety, what's wrong with that?

Off the top of my head: * If the design of your car makes you a less safe driver, you are more likely to crash into me. * The US as a society has committed (surprisingly recently) to providing emergency care to anyone who shows up at a hospital before asking whether they can pay. Car accidents are a sadly common reason for people requiring emergency care. That means that reducing car accidents is a public benefit. *…

I wouldn't consider 1986 particularly recent, regarding the COBRA/Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act particularly recent. Considering that civil rights was still a large issue well into the early 80's. Not that there aren't civil rights issues today, it's mostly that the outrage is much larger than any actual issues persisting.

Consumer protection on the other hand, is quite a bit longer in the tooth. Though did really start after the 50's. I know the original erector sets were particularly bad, as were earlier die cast models, etc.