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Interview with the creators of levels.fyi

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Re: Interview with the creators of levels.fyi

#41

Post by fizwhiz »

a1pulley wrote: post #39
bradlys wrote: post #29

Facebook and Google are only setting the pay standard among other well paying public companies. The rest of the valley isn't keeping up. Startups in particular feel like slowly ramped up in pay but capped out. They're not offering enough stock to make up for it either. Usually only enough to make it such that your TC at startup would be equal to that of a big company IF the company IPO's/sells. (A big IF!) I don't se…

I've actually had the opposite experience with Google. I'm currently negotiating a job offer at Google; my initial offer was significantly lower than my four other ones. It's TBD whether they'll end up matching, but my recruiter has been trying to systematically deconstruct the argument for working at a local competitor to make the case that 0.67 * other offer = Google offer. I'm not sure if they'll end up matching -…

Google doesn't generally care about near-IPO companies unless they're decacorns (and still apply a discount to the competing offer's equity). Google comp only lags behind Netflix for: a) Non-staff levels b) Candidates that don't have competing offers.

It's not unusual to see a huge pay discrepancy based on your ability to negotiate. It also depends on what ladder you're applying to (i.e. you can't compare a Solutions engineer comp at Google to a SWE at some other company).

Re: Interview with the creators of levels.fyi

#42

Post by Zaheer »

a1pulley wrote: post #39
bradlys wrote: post #29

Facebook and Google are only setting the pay standard among other well paying public companies. The rest of the valley isn't keeping up. Startups in particular feel like slowly ramped up in pay but capped out. They're not offering enough stock to make up for it either. Usually only enough to make it such that your TC at startup would be equal to that of a big company IF the company IPO's/sells. (A big IF!) I don't se…

I've actually had the opposite experience with Google. I'm currently negotiating a job offer at Google; my initial offer was significantly lower than my four other ones. It's TBD whether they'll end up matching, but my recruiter has been trying to systematically deconstruct the argument for working at a local competitor to make the case that 0.67 * other offer = Google offer. I'm not sure if they'll end up matching -…

Google in particular often starts will lower compensation but will match other offers (from Big-N companies) quickly. I'd recommend getting another Big-N offer and using that to negotiate. Some great resources for negotiation: - https://teamcandor.com/salary/guide/ - https://www.holloway.com/g/equity-compensation

Re: Interview with the creators of levels.fyi

#43

Post by Zaheer »

MuffinFlavored wrote: post #37
bradlys wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you working at the companies that show that level of pay? Are you located geographically the same as those offers? levels.fyi does not say everyone makes $300k+ - it says people at specific companies in a specific region make that much. It makes that quite obvious from how you have to select the companies, the level, and then you see where those offers are geographically and with how much experience/tenure.

Is there a map that shows the data geographically? It's hard to tell given the list of salaries + cities to find data the compares to my city.

Not yet - in the works! :)

Re: Interview with the creators of levels.fyi

#44

Post by [deleted] »

taurath wrote: post #40
bradlys wrote: post #29

Facebook and Google are only setting the pay standard among other well paying public companies. The rest of the valley isn't keeping up. Startups in particular feel like slowly ramped up in pay but capped out. They're not offering enough stock to make up for it either. Usually only enough to make it such that your TC at startup would be equal to that of a big company IF the company IPO's/sells. (A big IF!) I don't se…

Okay though, if you joined Big Co now and made $400k/yr, you'd be taking home $260k post-tax. Anyone can live even in the bay area on half of that, extremely comfortably. In 2-3 years you'd have your $300-400k for a down payment - thats 30% of a $1.2mm house. 2-3 years to buy a median priced place. Thats not bad. Also, prices in say, Santa Clara CA have gone -5.5% YoY, and are forecasted by zillow to go another -8% i…

[deleted]

Re: Interview with the creators of levels.fyi

#45

Post by bradlys »

taurath wrote: post #40
bradlys wrote: post #29

Facebook and Google are only setting the pay standard among other well paying public companies. The rest of the valley isn't keeping up. Startups in particular feel like slowly ramped up in pay but capped out. They're not offering enough stock to make up for it either. Usually only enough to make it such that your TC at startup would be equal to that of a big company IF the company IPO's/sells. (A big IF!) I don't se…

Okay though, if you joined Big Co now and made $400k/yr, you'd be taking home $260k post-tax. Anyone can live even in the bay area on half of that, extremely comfortably. In 2-3 years you'd have your $300-400k for a down payment - thats 30% of a $1.2mm house. 2-3 years to buy a median priced place. Thats not bad. Also, prices in say, Santa Clara CA have gone -5.5% YoY, and are forecasted by zillow to go another -8% i…

It's $230k after tax.

> Anyone can live even in the bay area on half of that, extremely comfortably.

You really might want to expand on "extremely comfortably". We all have very different definitions. I'd like a home with AC, good transportation, close enough to SF to actually make it up on weeknights (30-40 min drive), a retirement plan that works with the assumption I live in this area indefinitely, and a <=20 minute commute. I will not have that for $115-130k/yr net income. Just isn't available in the rental market we have. I'm not even getting into the part where I'd like to live in a nice neighborhood with good schools.

Re: Interview with the creators of levels.fyi

#46

Post by Zaheer »

H8crilA wrote: post #35
Zaheer wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maker here, what device & browser are you using? The email in chat is optional. You can ignore the input message for it if you would not like to share email address.

I had that once or twice (that it never fully loads), but for example now it loads perfectly fine. Android with latest Chrome. PS. bro you're great for making this happen. levels.fyi is like "software eating the world" for labor unions. Clean, elegant solution avoiding all the nasty labor unions politics. Now if we could also bring awareness around work/life balance!

If this ever happens please try to capture / send us any relevant details. We know there's some issues with Internet Explorer but not aware of any other issues.

Thanks for the kind words! Surfacing work / life balance and general workplace concerns is in our roadmap (3-6 months out). Look out for updates soon!

Re: Interview with the creators of levels.fyi

#47

Post by a1pulley »

Zaheer wrote: post #42
a1pulley wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've actually had the opposite experience with Google. I'm currently negotiating a job offer at Google; my initial offer was significantly lower than my four other ones. It's TBD whether they'll end up matching, but my recruiter has been trying to systematically deconstruct the argument for working at a local competitor to make the case that 0.67 * other offer = Google offer. I'm not sure if they'll end up matching -…

Google in particular often starts will lower compensation but will match other offers (from Big-N companies) quickly. I'd recommend getting another Big-N offer and using that to negotiate. Some great resources for negotiation: - https://teamcandor.com/salary/guide/ - https://www.holloway.com/g/equity-compensation

Thanks Zaheer! While I have your ear: my recruiter at "other company" pushed back on increasing RSU comp by saying packages were larger in the past but have decreased in size recently. If levels.fyi displayed offer date it might help validate or dispel arguments like that.

Re: Interview with the creators of levels.fyi

#48

Post by jldugger »

MuffinFlavored wrote: post #37
bradlys wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you working at the companies that show that level of pay? Are you located geographically the same as those offers? levels.fyi does not say everyone makes $300k+ - it says people at specific companies in a specific region make that much. It makes that quite obvious from how you have to select the companies, the level, and then you see where those offers are geographically and with how much experience/tenure.

Is there a map that shows the data geographically? It's hard to tell given the list of salaries + cities to find data the compares to my city.

I expect to see the high wages are highly concentrated in SV. My employer has a clear policy that leaving the bay area comes with a pay cut. Some folks think it's worth it. Time will tell.

Re: Interview with the creators of levels.fyi

#49

Post by Zaheer »

a1pulley wrote: post #47
Zaheer wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google in particular often starts will lower compensation but will match other offers (from Big-N companies) quickly. I'd recommend getting another Big-N offer and using that to negotiate. Some great resources for negotiation: - https://teamcandor.com/salary/guide/ - https://www.holloway.com/g/equity-compensation

Thanks Zaheer! While I have your ear: my recruiter at "other company" pushed back on increasing RSU comp by saying packages were larger in the past but have decreased in size recently. If levels.fyi displayed offer date it might help validate or dispel arguments like that.

Ah interesting. One thing that might help: we collect # of Years at Company. There isn't a way to filter on the compensation page for it but you can click a row to see this info. Additionally, on the main page if you click on a level at a company > click View a few data points > chart contains a feature to filter by years at company. We're working on standardizing this display functionality across the site with better filtration / search.

Re: Interview with the creators of levels.fyi

#50

Post by powvans »

MuffinFlavored wrote: post #34
clintonb wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Location matters. $140K in a low cost of living area is not the same as $140 in the Bay Area.

I am in South Florida (somewhere in between Miami + Fort Lauderdale cost of living) levels.fyi shows people making $300k in Austin, TX (which as far as I know, is not a high cost of living area) What are some areas that are comparable to South Florida that are listed on levels.fyi?

Google has an engineering office in Austin. Could be someone who took their Bay Area salary with them. Same with Pittsburg. Uber has a presence there and SFBA transplants take their SFBA salaries with them when they move.
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